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From Paul Hammant <paul_hamm...@yahoo.com>
Subject Re: Incubator DOA (Re: [STATUS] Tapestry [LACK-OF] Progress)
Date Tue, 11 Mar 2003 09:09:01 GMT
Jeff,

There is more than just Tapestry in incubator.

- Paul

 --- Jeff Turner <jefft@apache.org> wrote: > Feh.
> 
> Incubation was a dumb idea from the start.  It is busy failing in
> practice.
> 
> PMCs should manage the acceptance of new subprojects, not some
> disinterested Incubator PMC.
> 
> IMHO, scrap this failed experiment and let Tapestry migrate to Jakarta
> without being further jerked around.
> 
> I feel I'm stating the blindingly obvious.  Is it just me?
> 
> 
> --Jeff
> 
> On Mon, Mar 10, 2003 at 06:58:22PM -0500, Howard M. Lewis Ship wrote:
> > How, exactly, is Tapestry ever expected to exit the proposal stage?
> > 
> > Despite repeated attempts, Tapestry is NOT in BugZilla.  We're still forced
> > to use SourceForge for bug tracking.
> > 
> > Tapestry's mailing lists are not getting archived any more (not since 2/21).
> > 
> > Nobody seems to know ANY of the procedures for getting things done.  Nothing
> > is documented.  Simple things like the correct way to distribute a release
> > (including signing and mirroring) are just "known" by the right people ...
> > and I don't even know who is in the know.
> > 
> > Andrew and Dion have been helpful, both before the move and after.
> > 
> > The only other accomplishment of the incubation process has been a code
> > audit that resulted in a shuffling of the libraries checked into CVS and
> > distributed with the framework.
> > 
> > Jakarta infrastructure is non-existent. Worse, the Jakarta culture
> > erroneously expects things to get done based on e-mails, rather than
> > something organized, like using BugZilla to track infrastructure requests. 
> > 
> > The Incubator team has yet to provide a time table or a check list to
> > indicate what the exit criteria are.  In terms of Tapestry's commitments to
> > the Incubator, it looks like we're more than there (based on
> > http://incubator.apache.org/process.html).  In terms of Incubator's
> > commitments to Tapestry ... that is, to assist Tapestry in moving into
> > Jakarta, fitting in, and accessing infrastructure; very little has been
> > accomplished.
> > 
> > --
> > Howard M. Lewis Ship
> > Creator, Tapestry: Java Web Components
> > http://jakarta.apache.org/proposals/tapestry
> 
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