Mailing-List: contact flex-dev-help@incubator.apache.org; run by ezmlm
Precedence: bulk
Reply-To: flex-dev@incubator.apache.org
Received-SPF: pass (athena.apache.org: domain of gosmith@adobe.com designates
 64.18.1.237 as permitted sender)
From: Gordon Smith <gosmith@adobe.com>
To: "flex-dev@incubator.apache.org" <flex-dev@incubator.apache.org>
Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2012 11:27:45 -0800
Subject: RE: Flex 5 in haxe
Thread-Topic: Flex 5 in haxe
Thread-Index: Ac3D6BrguD83veyDTze2nUT+V6c8xwARx2UA
Message-ID: 
 <149F8129B58B2D418508E63117D9C5419B5B35FEF7@nambx05.corp.adobe.com>
References: 
 <CAMFKFRjVqyYP6+NV+-nw_YDc_UNTDeWnUg-AYZvnkhk4o7Q7uw@mail.gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: 
 <CAMFKFRjVqyYP6+NV+-nw_YDc_UNTDeWnUg-AYZvnkhk4o7Q7uw@mail.gmail.com>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
MIME-Version: 1.0

> Since Falcon has little support of MXML, I see we don't loose almost noth=
ing.

Given that Falcon can compile MXML apps like Checkinapp, I don't think it's=
 accurate to characterize its level of MXML support as "little". My own cha=
racterization would be "80% complete". But completing the other 20% is a da=
unting task ( it's certainly many person-months of work) and not enough peo=
ple are stepping up to help. I'm guessing that this is because the major co=
mpanies who used to use Flex and swore that they had plenty of compiler eng=
ineers who would help finish Falcon have moved on to other technologies.

So I agree that any and all compiler technologies, including Haxe, should g=
et serious consideration.

However, I think before Apache Flex makes a compiler decision, it needs to =
decide what runtimes it is targeting. Move to V12? Abandon Flash? Produce H=
TML/JS? Produce native iOS code? Produce native Java for Android?

- Gordon


-----Original Message-----
From: carlos.rovira@gmail.com [mailto:carlos.rovira@gmail.com] On Behalf Of=
 Carlos Rovira
Sent: Friday, November 16, 2012 2:49 AM
To: flex-dev@incubator.apache.org
Subject: Flex 5 in haxe

Hi,

as we were discussing yesterday, there's room to a new Flex framework writt=
en from scratch. As we don't want to rely in Adobe technologies anymore we =
were talking about haxe. We can make it now that work would be starting fro=
m zero.

Haxe is a platform developed by Nicolas Canesse that made it's own communit=
y. Nicolas is a genius of compilers. People coming from Flash Open Source w=
ill remember MTASC compiler back in 2004-5. If you search and investigate y=
ou will found that haxe is very powerful and is "the great unknown technolo=
gy".

http://haxe.org/

haxeNME is like Adobe AIR and seems to be more performant in iOS, and Andro=
id (see http://esdot.ca/site/2012/performance-showdown-starling-vs-nd2d-vs-=
genome2d-vs-haxe-nme).
Supports as well Windows, Mac, Linux and BB.

http://www.haxenme.org/

There's an haxe plugin for IntelliJ. But in my test it seems that only supp=
orts haxe and not NME yet.

(Disclaimer: I'm to new to haxe and haxeNME and maybe I wrong making some s=
tatements here).

- Haxe is OOP and is "one language to rule them all" philoshopy.

- Haxe compiler is better that the set provided by Adobe (I'm referring to
AS3 legacy compiler. Falcon is new technology and maybe this is not true. I=
 does not have any info to make a comparision between falcon and haxe compi=
ler).

- Haxe language is more evolved (maybe even Adobe AS4 will copy things from
haxe...)

- Haxe support HTML5/JS out of the box (but it seems to be in beta status).

- There's a Starling port in haxe.

Regarding Flex: haxe compiler could bring to flex things like *metadata
evolution* or *AOP*. Adobe compiler will never get that evolution since gam=
ming is not focused in that kind of things...This is more likely to see in =
haxe if Flex 5 works than expect it from Adobe.

Drawbacks:

IDE: IntelliJ+haxe plugin. IntelliJ is the best option for Flex, and suppor=
ts haxe, but I think haxeNME is not supported yet. But IntelliJ guys are be=
hind the plugin, so things could evolve ok in this point.

MXML: I think there's nothing like MXML in haxe today, and this is one of t=
he key points in Flex. We would need to put the efforts of MXML in making i=
t possible in haxe. We could talk with Nicolas Canesse about this possibili=
ty. Since Falcon has little support of MXML, I see we don't loose almost no=
thing.

So my proposal is:

* Start Flex 5 from scratch with haxe.

* Use the Flex 4 API to model Flex 5 over haxe (as the first draft).

* Start using Starling haxe library as the core displayobject API (to be ab=
le to target Stage3D/Workers in  Flash).

* Make an UIComponent decoupled implementation based on composition over in=
heritance (here experience of Alex Harui and other will be very wellcome to=
 start with a good foundation).

Optional:

* Take into account the SWF and HTML5 outputs in the first drafts.

This would start as an experiment based on fun of coding, and we could see =
where it goes over time. If it gets momentum, people join the cause, and so=
 on...


--
Carlos Rovira
Director de Tecnolog=EDa
M: +34 607 22 60 05
F:  +34 912 35 57 77
http://www.codeoscopic.com
http://www.directwriter.es
http://www.avant2.es