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From Omar Gonzalez <omarg.develo...@gmail.com>
Subject Re: List of Inactive Apache Flex PPMC Members
Date Thu, 15 Nov 2012 23:45:19 GMT
On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 3:30 PM, Om <bigosmallm@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 2:13 PM, Michael A. Labriola <
> labriola@digitalprimates.net> wrote:
>
> > >Just to be clear, I'm not trying to kick anybody out. I only think it's
> > >fair that we hold the PMC members to the same standards as we do
> > >prospective committers, don't you?
> >
> > Well, to be fair, I sort of actually hate that too...
> >
> > What does it mean to commit time to a project like this? Is it only code
> > commits that count? That seems like a narrow vision of what's important
> to
> > a project like this.
> >
> > What about people who present, write about or educate on Flex? Worked on
> > getting/keeping Flex inside of corporations during our transition time to
> > Apache? People raising awareness... you get the point. If there is one
> > thing I find a little disturbing about the idea of PMC and Committers
> being
> > the same group is that it seems to value code commits above all else. In
> my
> > opinion that is a fraction of what makes any project/product successful.
> >
> > When I first read about Apache I actually thought these were two separate
> > groups most of the time and found it slightly disappointing that they
> seem
> > to be more aligned than not.
> >
> > Mike
> >
> >
> You are right, PMC members dont necessarily have to contribute code.  But
> they have to contribute something - anything.  Pick from the list you
> mentioned.  We also have committers who are not PMC members.  We have been
> careful not to automatically elevate a committer to a PMC member.
>

If I recall correctly, we've only not elevated directly to PMC in a small
handful of occasions, when the new committers had not yet actually
contributed patches but were working on big code grants/contributions to
the project. I believe it was encouraged and most people were voted
directly as PPMC/committers.



>
> There are a fairly significant number of non-coders in the current PMC.
>  Maybe they should actively recruit folks that do interaction design,
> evangelism, etc.  The lack of such activity does not mean that we should
> not invite new coders/committers into Apache Flex.
>

I don't think anyone has ever proposed stopping the invitations of new
committers. I believe its encouraged to add as many as are actively
participating and contributing to the project as we can find that are
active and accepting of the invitation.


>
> More of both is what we need.  I have personally reached out to non-coders
> who have been active on this list to see if they are interested in becoming
> PPMC members.  And we should all be doing that regularly.
>

Sure, it just takes a simple nomination by PPMC members, that's never been
discouraged that I recall.


>
> But this is tangential to the current discussion.  Erik raises a valid
> question here.  We are at the cusp of graduating and we need to figure out
> what standards we want an Apache Flex PMC member should be held to.  Lets
> all agree to a standard and start adhering to it.
>
> Thanks,
> Om
>

What standards? The decision of whether or not they should be a (P)PMC
member is always done at the time of voting them in as new ppmc/committers.
Once they're voted in there's no real standard, that is why people aren't
really removed once they're committers. People earn their way in with
activity and a vote in, and after being voted in, for whatever kind of life
reasons their activity reduces there aren't demotions or removal of
peoples, so I don't see the necessity for a defined standard for PMC
members. It really all comes down to the vote when they're added.

Am I wrong here? Glad we're keeping some mentors around for these
discussions, maybe they can chime in a little bit here.

-Omar

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