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From "Chen, Pei" <>
Subject Re: cTAKES 3.0.0 Feedback Was: RE: [DISCUSS] Graduate cTAKES from Incubator
Date Tue, 19 Feb 2013 14:45:14 GMT
> - The downloads page must work. It now seems to function alright ***IF*** you refresh
the page or select a mirror and click the Change button.

Hi Troy,
I think this was fixed. Links (sidenav) were updated to use downloads.cgi instead of html.
 Could you confirm?

On Feb 18, 2013, at 11:58 AM, "Bleeker, Troy C." <> wrote:

> All the suggestions and discussion are good. There's a lot here, sorry for the long summary.
First things first:
> - The downloads page must work. It now seems to function alright ***IF*** you refresh
the page or select a mirror and click the Change button. If you do neither and try to download
you get this error: "The requested URL /ctakes/[preferred]incubator/ctakes/apache-ctakes-3.0.0-incubating-bin.tar.gz
was not found on this server." Anyone have time to fix this?
> - Adding a link to the install instructions makes it obvious (which I have done to the
page) but it was there in a sense. The page said "Use the Developer and User Guides to direct
you through the installation process." and the links to those were just to the left in the
> - "Last official release" was held until now. Since 3.0 is going to be officially announced,
3.0 will go there. I made that change as well.
> - A list of changed features has not been high priority since the original goal was to
make a 3.0 in Apache that pretty much matched the function of 2.5. The only thing that changed
was how the product is built and shipped. Nevertheless we need to state at least that somewhere.
> - The resources file is 1.1 GB not 2 right?
> Keep in mind that the community decided to release cTAKES 3.0 without the doc being complete,
but these must be next:
> - The current guides are still not complete. I made it through the developer guide but
the user guide still has problems. I get errors after installing and running scripts. I have
not been able to try the comparison test that was available previously. The table at the bottom
I have not got to yet.
> - We have 2 sites now 1) cTAKES home 2) cTAKES doc I've done my best to minimize a user going
back and forth. We have it this way because a useful guide is not easy (IMHO or even possible)
with markdown text in the cTAKES home pages. There are still 3.0 developer and user guide
pages on the cTAKES home site that should be removed so no one stumbles on to them.
> - Where would a newcomer hit first? Internet search for "ctakes" or "ctakes 3.0" is probably
first. Top hits on those lists should be modified to point to the best Apache cTAKES landing
> - The Getting Started page needs to be written in context of all future releases not
just 3.0.
> - Previous releases list. We need to both point to the NCI sites for 2.6 and back plus
create an archive for what will be the history of Apache releases. Needs work your right.
> Potential priorities after that:
> - The examples, as described by Andy, would be more than a readme should have. This would
be great for a how-to guide.
> - The Developer Guide and User Guide have historically been install guides not how-to
guides. I don't think a how-to guide should be incorporated into these but should be its own
> - cTAKES has never had a how-to guide that I know of. Making one would be great and as
you say should include things like 1) pointers to where to find basic information 2) very
high level overview of the components in the context of using them to do a very basic task
like 3) 
> I think it was suggested that the Getting Started page might be something like this in
very short form. If we did that then it would point to a more comprehensive how-to guide.
> - Project history page of all cTAKES releases placed on Apache sites somewhere. Good
plan if short. I would not copy readmes there but have links to them.
> I already did this for cTAKES 2.5 and past:
> Move this page to Apache? Have a page on Apache that continues this and points back to
what already exists?
> Also, I had this project history on the Apache cTAKES downloads page but that section
was removed when 3.0 was placed on there. If you can find the history of changes to that page
you may find something already done in markdown format.
> - Creating a single download for a newcomer. This has been discussed and tabled by the
community for the time being in order to get the 3.0 release done and out the door. We need
to come back to this in order to make the best first impression.
> Troy
> -----Original Message-----
> From: []
On Behalf Of Chen, Pei
> Sent: Friday, February 15, 2013 10:17 PM
> To:
> Subject: cTAKES 3.0.0 Feedback Was: RE: [DISCUSS] Graduate cTAKES from Incubator
> Thanks Andy for the feedback.
> Examples are a good idea- Were you thinking of adding it to the README file or the confluence
user guide?
> Feel free to update the downloads page(s) (it uses Apache CMS) and the User Guides (Confluence
> Note: The release is still being replicated to all of the mirrors and may take up to
24 hrs, so I would wait until after the weekend before testing all of the mirror links.
> --Pei
> ________________________________________
> From: Andy McMurry []
> Sent: Friday, February 15, 2013 11:08 PM
> To:
> Subject: Re: [DISCUSS] Graduate cTAKES from Incubator
> Clarifications
> There isn't a last Apache release. But there are last previous NIH, Sourceforge, and
Apache releases?
> TODO: Project History Page (Simple, just the releases and times, ideally with JIRA generated
release notes).
> Suggestion: Demonstration > explanation. Use Examples !!
> EXAMPLE 1 : Basic Pipeline (without UMLS)
> ** SHOW Before and after clinical text, demonstrates purpose
> ** LIST the 5 steps
> ** Most impressive demo would be the smoking status pipeline
> EXAMPLE 2: Basic Pipeline (with UMLS)
> ** SHOW Before and after (input text -> output annotations)
> ** LIST the steps
> ** Most impressive demo would be a negation of a cancer diagnosis and NER of a medication
(chemotherapuetic drug).
> Thoughts?
> --andy
> On Feb 15, 2013, at 7:36 PM, Andy McMurry <> wrote:
>> Sure thing Pei.
>> I dont think cTAKES is ready for attention grabbing release (humble opinion).
>> And when you release you want to grab attention! ! cTAKES is awesome!!
>> Suggestions (release blockers)
>> (1) Downloads
>> ! Link to install instructions is not there but "Verifying signatures" takes up 20%
>> ! Last official release is blank because there isn't one, remove it ! 
>> First mirror I tried was a 404? (not sure which one). I changed the 
>> mirror then OK. Test all mirrors (script) ? Previous releases are VERY confusing.
>> ? The NIH and SourceForge pages  should redirect to cTAKES, google "cTAKES download"
and imagine how confused a beginner would be.
>> (2) User Guide
>> ? 3.0.0 : no list of new features from last stable release. Why would a user bother
to upgrade to a beta?
>> ! Would be better to have a bundled download with resources, if possible. Otherwise,
make it clear to a newcomer what the benefit of getting UMLS / LVG is. (one sentence).
>> ! Needs a very high level overview of the components in the context of using them
to do a very basic task like.
>> ! This is likely the most frequently accessed document for cTAKES. It has almost
no pointers to where to find basic information.
>> (3) OTHER
>> * The NCI and SourceForge links are now highly confusing.
>> * While I am downloading, I should be reading the recommended "Get 
>> Started" guide
>> I'm still downloading the 2GB resources file.
>> I'll try and get back to you about the install when that is done too.
>> This constructive criticism is because I believe cTAKES is AWESOME.
>> Hard to see how awesome it is given the current instructions.
>> --Andy
>> On Feb 15, 2013, at 5:02 PM, "Chen, Pei" <> wrote:
>>> Hi Andy,
>>> So much has changed in cTAKES since last year, if you have a chance- do you also
want to try downloading the -bin and ensure at least the steps in the README are able to get
you started?
>>> --Pei
>>> ________________________________________
>>> From: Andy McMurry []
>>> Sent: Friday, February 15, 2013 4:04 PM
>>> To:
>>> Subject: Re: [DISCUSS] Graduate cTAKES from Incubator
>>> Suggestion: can we get a good programmer with no cTAKES experience to kick the
tires and tell us how long it took to get started?
>>> John Resig (jQuery founder) once told me "if it takes more than 15 minutes to
get started, then that is way too long".
>>> "What is necessary is that enough investment be put into presentation 
>>> that newcomers can get past the obstacle of unfamiliarity. ... Hactivation energy:
the amount of energy a newcomer must put in before she starts getting something back"
>>> -- From "Producing Open Source Software"
>>> ktivation+energy&source=bl&ots=D0hP85ndwz&sig=G5HO-7GbLqQPwLaI6210D9W
>>> Gk2E&hl=en&sa=X&ei=N6EeUZXVHMHhiALq3YG4BQ&ved=0CDoQ6AEwAQ#v=onepage&q
>>> =hacktivation%20energy&f=false
>>> On Feb 15, 2013, at 12:55 PM, "Chen, Pei" <>
>>>> This is to open a discussion to graduate Apache cTAKES podling from the Apache
>>>> Apache cTAKES entered the Incubator in June of 2012. We have made significant
progress with the project since moving over to Apache. We currently have 18 committers listed
on our status page at [1] including over 10 which accepted after the podling was formed.
>>>> During incubation, cTAKES has :
>>>> * Produced 1 Release
>>>> * Added 10 new Committer/PPMC members and shows constant community 
>>>> activities
>>>> * Cleared IP on code
>>>> * Developed Roadmap(s) for the next major and minor releases in a 
>>>> community process and started working on that [2]
>>>> * The community of Apache cTAKES is active, healthy, and growing and has
demonstrated the ability to self-govern using accepted Apache practices.
>>>> [1]
>>>> [2] 
>>>> an.jira.plugin.system.project%3Aroadmap-panel

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