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From "Bleeker, Troy C." <Bleeker.T...@mayo.edu>
Subject RE: Apache Confluence wiki for documentation?
Date Fri, 14 Sep 2012 13:53:52 GMT
Sorry, I was unaware of the conversation that happened in INFRA-5158. That plus the email below
brings up some questions for me.

I've been down this road a number of times. My vote would be to never distribute the documentation
with a release. In a world where the cTAKES users must have an Internet connection to obtain
cTAKES then they have always shown to use that connection while developing. Meaning they can
always get to the documentation when needed. If you ship it in a release you put out copies
that you cannot change without more work. As fixes happen in documentation too, you can more
easily make sure the next developer does not hit the same documentation issue if you fix the
only copy there is - the online one.

Why put ourselves through yet another migration, Confluence to MoinMoin, if we don't need
the export?

We are in charge of the navigation in Confluence. James, what is it that does not work for
you? If you're basing your opinion on the current site, it has had navigational items forced
into it by NCI. I like Confluence better than, for example, MediaWiki because it forces the
developer to think about the logical structure of the site, allows the users to be in control
of navigation (the tree on the left can be on/off), and (except at NCI where it is now) an
administrator can change the look (CSS underneath it). Maybe Apache does not allow their CWIKI
look to change. Anyone know?

Admittedly I don't know anything about MoinMoin yet, but has anyone experience with things
like the editor? Confluence's is nice. Search? How about managing uploaded files? Just a little
digging reveals that underneath MoinMoin is yet another syntax, close but not the same as
Confluence. 

Thanks
Troy
-----Original Message-----
From: ctakes-dev-return-385-Bleeker.Troy=mayo.edu@incubator.apache.org [mailto:ctakes-dev-return-385-Bleeker.Troy=mayo.edu@incubator.apache.org]
On Behalf Of Jörn Kottmann
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2012 2:57 AM
To: ctakes-dev@incubator.apache.org
Subject: Re: Apache Confluence wiki for documentation?

Its nice to include the documentation in the distribution of the release, but that will likely
not work as easily when they disable the export feature of Confluence.

Jörn

On 09/14/2012 12:23 AM, Masanz, James J. wrote:
> I see there was an INFRA JIRA issue opened for creating a cwiki but 
> then closed until we decide if we really want to go with Confluence.
> https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-5185
>
> I'm not sure I follow how INFRA-5185's description of having export 
> turned off in December will affect us.
> I was assuming we would not export anything from an apache-hosted wiki 
> to anywhere else.
> Did I misunderstand the point raised in INFRA-5185 or was someone 
> planning to export out of an apache-hosted wiki
>
> I'm not a fan of the look of and the navigation through Confluence 
> pages. And I like the idea of flat files that moin uses rather than a 
> database but I'm no wiki engine expert.
>
> I therefore suggest we go with moin.
>
> -- James
>
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: 
>> ctakes-dev-return-381-Masanz.James=mayo.edu@incubator.apache.org
>>
> [mailto:ctakes-dev-return-381-Masanz.James=mayo.edu@incubator.apache.o
> rg
> ]
>> On Behalf Of Bleeker, Troy C.
>> Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2012 1:13 PM
>> To: ctakes-dev@incubator.apache.org
>> Subject: RE: Apache Confluence wiki for documentation?
>>
>> I was looking at the cTAKES issues and comments about the SVN load.
> Too
>> bad they seem to be dragging their feet, but if you think about the
> amount
>> of time cTAKES has been under development, waiting for what seems 
>> like
> a
>> long time now will pay off for years. I digress.
>>
>> This made me think about the documentation again. I was wondering if
> we
>> had placed the request to Apache to create our Confluence? If not 
>> then
> I
>> wonder if that can get kicked off too?
>>
>> Pei, is that something you would do? I don't think I can since we are 
>> still waiting on our corporate CLA.
>>
>> Thanks
>> Troy
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: 
>> ctakes-dev-return-249-Bleeker.Troy=mayo.edu@incubator.apache.org
>>
> [mailto:ctakes-dev-return-249-Bleeker.Troy=mayo.edu@incubator.apache.o
> rg
>> ] On Behalf Of Chen, Pei
>> Sent: Monday, August 20, 2012 11:11 AM
>> To: ctakes-dev@incubator.apache.org
>> Subject: RE: Apache Confluence wiki for documentation?
>>
>> Good point on the getting started page.  Added a "Getting Started"
>> section within General:
>> http://ctakes.staging.apache.org/ctakes/
>>
>> Since Apache provides the infrastructure (SVN, Wiki, Jira, Compile 
>> Servers, Continuous Integration, etc.), I think it would be nice to
> have
>> things in a single place and managed by a single infrastructure.  We
> also
>> seem to have documentation on SF, Wikipedia, NCI, Mayo wiki; it would
> be a
>> good opportunity to consolidate (Even it just means, migrating 
>> content from existing sources.)
>> Troy:  Do you have your Apache ID created?  Would be great if someone
> had
>> experience with this help us out in this area...
>>
>> --Pei
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Bleeker, Troy C. [mailto:Bleeker.Troy@mayo.edu]
>> Sent: Monday, August 20, 2012 11:46 AM
>> To: ctakes-dev@incubator.apache.org
>> Subject: RE: Apache Confluence wiki for documentation?
>>
>> When someone first approaches cTAKES it is hard to understand just 
>> the list of components. The current site starts with an overview and 
>> then branches into each of the releases. Would the cTAKES Apache site
>> (http://ctakes.staging.apache.org/ctakes/) be better served by a
> Getting
>> Started link and then each of the releases?
>>
>> When you say "request an wiki instance" what do you mean? cTAKES
> already
>> has a wiki separate from Apache that is the existing supplement. Why 
>> create a 3rd documentation location?
>>
>> Thanks
>> Troy
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: 
>> ctakes-dev-return-245-Bleeker.Troy=mayo.edu@incubator.apache.org
>>
> [mailto:ctakes-dev-return-245-Bleeker.Troy=mayo.edu@incubator.apache.o
> rg
>> ] On Behalf Of Chen, Pei
>> Sent: Monday, August 20, 2012 10:44 AM
>> To: ctakes-dev@incubator.apache.org
>> Subject: RE: Apache Confluence wiki for documentation?
>>
>> Yes... That's what I'm thinking; either that or have a small blurb
> about
>> each on the main CMS site and have a link to the wiki from there.
>> But either way, I'll request a wiki site for us to explore with.
>>
>> --Pei
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Masanz, James J. [mailto:Masanz.James@mayo.edu]
>> Sent: Monday, August 20, 2012 11:42 AM
>> To: ctakes-dev@incubator.apache.org
>> Subject: RE: Apache Confluence wiki for documentation?
>>
>> +1 for Wiki
>>
>> Those side nav links  for cTAKES component documentation would then
> link
>> to the Wiki, right?
>>
>> -- James
>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: ctakes-dev-return-243-
>>> Masanz.James=mayo.edu@incubator.apache.org
> [mailto:ctakes-dev-return-
>>> 243-Masanz.James=mayo.edu@incubator.apache.org] On Behalf Of Chen,
> Pei
>>> Sent: Monday, August 20, 2012 10:19 AM
>>> To: ctakes-dev@incubator.apache.org
>>> Subject: Apache Confluence wiki for documentation?
>>>
>>> Added cTAKES components to the Side Nav for quick reference:
>>> Staging Preview:
>>> http://ctakes.staging.apache.org/ctakes/
>>>
>>> Any objections of requesting an wiki instance for technical
>> documentation to
>>> supplement the main Apache CMS site?  I think it'll be easier to
>> edit/maintain
>>> for technical documentation for each of the components...
>>> CTAKES-7<https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/CTAKES-7>
>>>
>>> --Pei


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