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From "Mattmann, Chris A (388J)" <>
Subject Re: SVN source structure for Apache cTAKES?
Date Mon, 23 Jul 2012 15:53:26 GMT
Hi Pei,

First off, thanks for your replies and yes I think you've picked up on the core of the issue:
we are not trying to be difficult here, but at the same time, I think there are a bit of some
growing pains that will need to be overcome since you guys have explicitly requested
to be part of the Apache Software Foundation and that carries with it a set of expectations
that more or less need to be dealt with.

You are doing a great job of communicating and helping out, so please keep it up. At the
same time, I have some comments below:

On Jul 23, 2012, at 8:18 AM, Chen, Pei wrote:

> Hi,
> My apologies as we tried to be transparent as we can in the original project proposal:
> - There are currently over 50 contributors/developers actively contributing to cTAKES
spread across over 8 sites (Mayo, BCH, Colorado University, Pittsburgh, UCSD, MITRE, etc.).
> - We have already communicated to developers as well as known users about the move to
Apache as soon as we could.  They have also been invited to the various ctakes-dev@ mailing
lists as soon as they were created (which seems to be a first logical step in also becoming

There is nothing in the above that mentions a 2.6 release pending at That's my point.
Intended forthcoming releases
are something that are fairly important to mention when coming into Apache. The expectation
is that you guys had an existing
community before hand and you brought the code and community to Apache for some reason --
but that whatever you guys 
had before coming here would also *come here* and not be continued *in parallel* to what's
going on here. That's all I'm 
trying to say, take it over leave it. 

> If there is anything we could have clarified, please let us know. We are grateful to
have such active mentors help us out here and feel free to ask us any questions regarding
cTAKES itself (as we may not even know enough about the Apache way to ask the right questions
:) ).  I'm all for being open and transparent as much as we could.

+1, great thanks, appreciate it.

> Regarding the 2.6 release: 
> If it is okay with the group, I would strongly suggest to keep 2.6 as planned (in SF)
 for now.  There were communication and expectations that went out already for it to be completed
by next week.

That's the problem I have -- where are these communications occurring? Why are they not occurring
here on the Apache
cTAKES list?

> The code was already done and frozen some time ago, documentation/links was also already
done some time ago as well (so there is really no duplication of effort here).

How long is some time ago -- was it before proposing to the Apache Incubator? 

> Note: There is a window over the next 2-3 months where there are no expected/scheduled
changes the current code base which we could take advantage of.  All of the developers are
aware of the migration; so we can make a clean cut from SourceForge in the code and therefore
we can also have a coordinated effort amongst all of the developers.  I am confident that
we will have many more release (probably fair frequent initially) while we are in incubation,
but I think the Apache way is still a learning process for us,  let alone 50 other developers.

And here's another concern I have -- where are these 50 developers and if there are 50 people
with merit in cTAKES working on the project in some form or fashion, how come there are only
a handful of committers and PPMC members here?

>  I'll be more than happy to create a mirror/snapshot of what's currently in SF and we'll
begin the process.

I think that may well be a great solution to help get things going -- but I'm more concerned
with the answers to the process
and community questions I posed above. In terms of concrete actions, at the very least I would

1. Figuring out how to rectify or better explain the discrepancy between the # of cTAKES committers/contributors
that apparently are participating in cTAKES but are not doing so here, at least formally
through Apache committership and PPMC membership.

2. Getting the 2.6 codebase for cTAKES in SVN ASAP and seriously considering making the 2.6
release *here* at the ASF. 
What is the problem with doing that? Are you concerned that it will add extra time?


Chris Mattmann, Ph.D.
Senior Computer Scientist
NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory Pasadena, CA 91109 USA
Office: 171-266B, Mailstop: 171-246
Adjunct Assistant Professor, Computer Science Department
University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA 90089 USA

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