From user-return-35949-apmail-cassandra-user-archive=cassandra.apache.org@cassandra.apache.org Thu Aug 15 04:16:08 2013 Return-Path: X-Original-To: apmail-cassandra-user-archive@www.apache.org Delivered-To: apmail-cassandra-user-archive@www.apache.org Received: from mail.apache.org (hermes.apache.org [140.211.11.3]) by minotaur.apache.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 890A910041 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 2013 04:16:08 +0000 (UTC) Received: (qmail 55624 invoked by uid 500); 15 Aug 2013 04:15:57 -0000 Delivered-To: apmail-cassandra-user-archive@cassandra.apache.org Received: (qmail 55575 invoked by uid 500); 15 Aug 2013 04:15:57 -0000 Mailing-List: contact user-help@cassandra.apache.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Post: List-Id: Reply-To: user@cassandra.apache.org Delivered-To: mailing list user@cassandra.apache.org Received: (qmail 55471 invoked by uid 99); 15 Aug 2013 04:15:57 -0000 Received: from nike.apache.org (HELO nike.apache.org) (192.87.106.230) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Thu, 15 Aug 2013 04:15:57 +0000 X-ASF-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.5 required=5.0 tests=HTML_MESSAGE,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW X-Spam-Check-By: apache.org Received-SPF: error (nike.apache.org: local policy) Received: from [209.85.223.175] (HELO mail-ie0-f175.google.com) (209.85.223.175) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Thu, 15 Aug 2013 04:15:51 +0000 Received: by mail-ie0-f175.google.com with SMTP id s9so556790iec.34 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 2013 21:15:10 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=google.com; s=20120113; h=x-gm-message-state:from:content-type:message-id:mime-version :subject:date:references:to:in-reply-to; bh=LfpWGhdRPxRAQrM56hFUEVQfM/C3QUybnj6CsHqeUaU=; b=U+3GdCI6lehtn5NC2n/ipGvRFBNfQ9FK3DwtZLEBoQ8mqoTMcGRPFf+WGl81RtUCWk YwsJgCTxwP/Ua0831UbrEHKMSquZ2823mVBDc9GWKNLLAJxxELl7EP5wNMtKAlOJ8a2r pEW1obnGUvD966hhe0e1mHb25q9iCQPUoKkCGT28yS0Xwp1llQQP0lJtENF9aICiyKbm DGAX6DMdEqG7p283rcJbIHvqI56HBjH/h278z4Fe6zsVx4VoUPOi56TEpganIdF3umR2 B2ErSNlwafs0pWCf6qx0MUpzQnQ7bgfhHgAlY2w93VW9aKn9TSxExm8/od8ipOhYSHvb TbIA== X-Gm-Message-State: ALoCoQkXbnH+IG4VQ5+hRNtIMKC4HzdPjY43beQQvf7vt5uyTAXL0pU9HgockxGPuqA/vkfNw1cg X-Received: by 10.43.61.199 with SMTP id wx7mr7299315icb.14.1376540110390; Wed, 14 Aug 2013 21:15:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [172.16.1.7] ([203.86.207.101]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id r6sm1891828igp.8.2013.08.14.21.15.08 for (version=TLSv1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Wed, 14 Aug 2013 21:15:09 -0700 (PDT) From: Aaron Morton Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_E0F68DB4-6D2D-4602-B6DD-94B705E88BD6" Message-Id: <33297E15-C428-434A-B4BC-D88A8D9283AC@thelastpickle.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 6.5 \(1508\)) Subject: Re: Recommendation for hosting multi tenant clusters Date: Thu, 15 Aug 2013 15:18:37 +1200 References: <0A40042D85E7C84DB443060EC44B3FD3475A3A110F@dekaexchange07.deka.local> <01749478-F54B-4527-AAFA-6918BB51F8F5@jonhaddad.com> <6994ED24-1E9C-464C-BB00-EF12C0204C64@instaclustr.com> To: user@cassandra.apache.org In-Reply-To: <6994ED24-1E9C-464C-BB00-EF12C0204C64@instaclustr.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1508) X-Virus-Checked: Checked by ClamAV on apache.org --Apple-Mail=_E0F68DB4-6D2D-4602-B6DD-94B705E88BD6 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 I also saw somewhere (may have been twitter) that the reads they = benchmark against for provisioned IOPS is something like 4KB or 8KB. It = was something small, smaller than the page size memmapping will use = anyway.=20 Cheers ----------------- Aaron Morton Cassandra Consultant New Zealand @aaronmorton http://www.thelastpickle.com On 14/08/2013, at 1:23 PM, Ben Bromhead wrote: > http://www.mail-archive.com/user@cassandra.apache.org/msg11022.html = sums it up pretty well. Optimised images and provisioned IOPS may help, = but whatever way you spin it your reads and writes are still going out = on the network somewhere. >=20 > EBS is like a giant SAN which will drop out at any second, take almost = everything in your region down with it whilst simultaneously opening up = a gate to hell that lets all sorts of unimaginable horrors into the = world.=20 >=20 > Ok maybe not that bad, but network issues between ebs and your = instances is painful. Whereas network issues with a single AZ can be = dealt with in the course of normal cluster operations. >=20 > On a slight tangent, have a read of = http://thelastpickle.com/2011/06/13/Down-For-Me/ which does an awesome = job of explaining what will happen to your quorum reads and writes when = a AWS AZ goes down (and you use ephemeral storage). >=20 > Cheers >=20 > Ben Bromhead > Instaclustr | www.instaclustr.com | @instaclustr | +61 415 936 359 >=20 >=20 > On 14/08/2013, at 10:42 AM, Jon Haddad wrote: >=20 >> I strongly recommend against EBS, even with optimized & ebs = provisioned. The throughput you'll get from local drives is = significantly better than what you'll get with EBS (even 4K iops = provisioned) >>=20 >> On Aug 13, 2013, at 2:10 PM, Rahul Gupta = wrote: >>=20 >>> I am working on requirement to host multi tenant Cassandra cluster = (or set of clusters) on Amazon EC2 (AWS). >>> =20 >>> With everything else sorted out, I have below question where I am = looking for recommendations: >>> =20 >>> Does Amazon=92s recent support of EBS optimized images changes whole = discussion around EBS vs. ephemeral drives and image size? >>> =20 >>> =B7 Option 1: reserved m1.xlarge (4x420GB drives) is = $0.187/hr >>> =B7 Option 2: reserved m1.large EBS-optimized is $0.119/hr = (~$50/month less than m1.xlarge, but $168/month for 4x420 standard EBS = volumes): costs $120/month more, but additional recovery options >>> =20 >>> Given Cassandra is designed to survive failures, combining = replication factor 3 and backing-up to S3, I think should be enough for = back up. >>> =20 >>> Please advise. >>> =20 >>> Thanks, >>> Rahul Gupta >>> DEKA Research & Development >>> 340 Commercial St Manchester, NH 03101 >>> P: 603.666.3908 extn. 6504 | C: 603.718.9676 >>> =20 >>> This e-mail and the information, including any attachments, it = contains are intended to be a confidential communication only to the = person or entity to whom it is addressed and may contain information = that is privileged. If the reader of this message is not the intended = recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution = or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have = received this communication in error, please immediately notify the = sender and destroy the original message. >>>=20 >>> =20 >>>=20 >>> This e-mail and the information, including any attachments, it = contains are intended to be a confidential communication only to the = person or entity to whom it is addressed and may contain information = that is privileged. If the reader of this message is not the intended = recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution = or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have = received this communication in error, please immediately notify the = sender and destroy the original message. >>>=20 >>> Thank you. >>>=20 >>> Please consider the environment before printing this email. >>=20 >=20 --Apple-Mail=_E0F68DB4-6D2D-4602-B6DD-94B705E88BD6 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 I = also saw somewhere (may have been twitter) that the reads they benchmark = against for provisioned IOPS is something like 4KB or 8KB. It was = something small, smaller than the page size memmapping will use = anyway. 

Cheers

-----------------
Aaron Morton
Cassandra = Consultant
New = Zealand

@aaronmorton

On 14/08/2013, at 1:23 PM, Ben Bromhead <ben@instaclustr.com> = wrote:

http://www.mail-archive.com/user@cassandra.apache.org/msg11022.html=  sums it up pretty well. Optimised images and provisioned IOPS may = help, but whatever way you spin it your reads and writes are still going = out on the network somewhere.

EBS is like a giant SAN = which will drop out at any second, take almost everything in your region = down with it whilst simultaneously opening up a gate to hell that lets = all sorts of unimaginable horrors into the = world. 

Ok maybe not that bad, but network = issues between ebs and your instances is painful. Whereas network issues = with a single AZ can be dealt with in the course of normal cluster = operations.

On a slight tangent, have a read = of http://thelastpi= ckle.com/2011/06/13/Down-For-Me/ which does an awesome job of = explaining what will happen to your quorum reads and writes when a AWS = AZ goes down (and you use ephemeral = storage).

Cheers

www.instaclustr.com | = @instaclustr | +61 = 415 936 359


On 14/08/2013, at 10:42 AM, Jon Haddad <jon@jonhaddad.com> = wrote:

I strongly recommend against = EBS, even with optimized & ebs provisioned.  The throughput = you'll get from local drives is significantly better than what you'll = get with EBS (even 4K iops provisioned)

On Aug 13, = 2013, at 2:10 PM, Rahul Gupta <rgupta@dekaresearch.com> = wrote:

I am = working on requirement to host multi tenant Cassandra cluster (or set of = clusters) on Amazon EC2 (AWS).
With everything else sorted out, I have below question where = I am looking for recommendations:
Does Amazon=92s recent support of EBS optimized images = changes whole discussion around EBS vs. ephemeral drives and image = size?
 
=B7 Option 1: reserved m1.xlarge = (4x420GB drives) is $0.187/hr
=B7 Option 2: reserved m1.large = EBS-optimized  is $0.119/hr (~$50/month less than m1.xlarge, but = $168/month for 4x420 standard EBS volumes): costs $120/month more, but = additional recovery options
 
Given = Cassandra is designed to survive failures, combining replication factor = 3 and backing-up to S3, I think should be enough for back = up.
Please advise.
Thanks,
340 Commercial St  Manchester, NH  = 03101
P: 603.666.3908 extn. 6504 | C: = 603.718.9676
This e-mail = and the information, including any attachments, it contains are intended = to be a confidential communication only to the person or entity to whom = it is addressed and may contain information that is privileged. If the = reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are hereby = notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this = communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this = communication in error, please immediately notify the sender and destroy = the original message.

This e-mail and the information, including any attachments, = it contains are intended to be a confidential communication only to the = person or entity to whom it is addressed and may contain information = that is privileged. If the reader of this message is not the intended = recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution = or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have = received this communication in error, please immediately notify the = sender and destroy the original message.

Thank you.

Please = consider the environment before printing this = email.



= --Apple-Mail=_E0F68DB4-6D2D-4602-B6DD-94B705E88BD6--