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From Denis Magda <dma...@apache.org>
Subject Re: Apache Ignite 2.7 release
Date Fri, 28 Sep 2018 16:48:43 GMT
Even though I was not involved in the Service Grid 2.0 architectural or
development discussions, my guts feel that we need to allocate enough time
to test them through. It won't be just a fix or minor improvement,
Vyacheslav has been working on a tremendous task that seems to re-engineer
many aspects of the component. Plus, keep in mind that the current service
grid engine is battle-tested and used in production, so every architectural
change has to be well tested.

Let's wait what the reviewers say (Anton and Nikolay). We need to allocate
enough time to test it thoroughly and that time can go beyond the timeframe
of 2.7.

--
Denis

On Fri, Sep 28, 2018 at 4:58 AM Vladimir Ozerov <vozerov@gridgain.com>
wrote:

> Importance come from the fact that we agreed on these dates. Neither
> community, nor implementors of the feature were against it. And community
> already work hard to met that dates: a lot of people already aligned their
> plans, a lot very important tickets were moved out of scope to met the
> dates.
>
> Nonsense - is to come at the end of coding phase and suggest to replay the
> plans all of a sudden. If you find it important - please start a separate
> discussion where it will be your responsibility to prove community that we
> have to realign our plans and delay release of all other features due to
> Service Grid being ahead of schedule. And solution to that problem will be
> very simple - to plan another release once Service Grid is coded, tested,
> reviewed and benchmarked.
>
> On Fri, Sep 28, 2018 at 2:31 PM Dmitriy Pavlov <dpavlov.spb@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> > Hi Dmitriy, Vladimir,
> >
> > I suggest we stop this nonsense with release dates-pushing because of
> some
> > open question.
> >
> > Just because you disagreed with any include/exclude something into scope,
> > does not mean that whole community disagreed.
> >
> > If folks will start a separate discussion with results of the review, I
> see
> > no reasons to reject their contribution, even if we need to revisit our
> > agreements and wait for a couple of days more.
> >
> > Am I missing some reason why dates are so fundamentally important to you?
> >
> > Sincerely,
> > Dmitriy Pavlov
> >
> > пт, 28 сент. 2018 г. в 12:20, Dmitriy Setrakyan <dsetrakyan@apache.org>:
> >
> > > If services is not ready, which it is not, then we should include them
> > into
> > > the next release. There is no need to force them into 2.7. I suggest we
> > > move according to the schedule we all agreed on.
> > >
> > > D.
> > >
> > > On Fri, Sep 28, 2018 at 1:22 AM Dmitriy Pavlov <dpavlov.spb@gmail.com>
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > > Yes, so correct statement is "community did not make any decisions
> > about
> > > > services not go to 2.7/ services are out of scope".
> > > >
> > > > If so, please forgive me my confusion.
> > > >
> > > > пт, 28 сент. 2018 г. в 11:19, Vladimir Ozerov <vozerov@gridgain.com
> >:
> > > >
> > > > > Exactly. So correct statement is “it is up to *community* to decide
> > > > whether
> > > > > something goes to 2.7”.
> > > > >
> > > > > пт, 28 сент. 2018 г. в 11:11, Dmitriy Pavlov <
> dpavlov.spb@gmail.com
> > >:
> > > > >
> > > > > > No, it is up to the community to discuss after their review
> > results.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > пт, 28 сент. 2018 г. в 11:09, Vladimir Ozerov <
> > vozerov@gridgain.com
> > > >:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > Dmitriy,
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Did I read your words correctly that it is up to implementor
> of a
> > > > > single
> > > > > > > feature to decide whether release of all other features
and
> fixes
> > > to
> > > > be
> > > > > > > delayed?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > пт, 28 сент. 2018 г. в 11:00, Dmitriy Pavlov <
> > > dpavlov.spb@gmail.com
> > > > >:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > My point we can wait a bit for services because
> > > > > > > > 1  we are open-minded and we don't have outside pressure
to
> do
> > > > > release
> > > > > > in
> > > > > > > > October
> > > > > > > > 2  and services it is not some new feature, which
suddenly
> > > appeared
> > > > > in
> > > > > > > > autumn, it is a well known and important feature.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > So it is up to Vyacheslav, Anton and Nikolay to decide.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Decisions can be services are not ready/ready to merge
only
> to
> > > > > > > master/ready
> > > > > > > > to merge to master and to 2.7.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > пт, 28 сент. 2018 г. в 10:46, Vladimir Ozerov
<
> > > > vozerov@gridgain.com
> > > > > >:
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Dmitry,
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Community agreement was to perform the release
in October.
> Of
> > > > > course
> > > > > > we
> > > > > > > > can
> > > > > > > > > wait a bit for services. Then we wait a bit for
other cool
> > > > features
> > > > > > > ready
> > > > > > > > > by that time, then again and again, and release
will never
> > > > happen.
> > > > > > And
> > > > > > > > > while we are waiting for new features to come,
already
> > > completerd
> > > > > > > > features
> > > > > > > > > cannot be used by anyone.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > This is why we have an agreement that if feature
is not
> > ready,
> > > it
> > > > > > > should
> > > > > > > > be
> > > > > > > > > moved to future release, instead of shifting
release. The
> > sole
> > > > > reason
> > > > > > > to
> > > > > > > > > have strict dates when decisions are made is
to let release
> > > > happen.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > On Fri, Sep 28, 2018 at 2:22 AM Dmitriy Pavlov
<
> > > > > > dpavlov.spb@gmail.com>
> > > > > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Vladimir,  I'm not searching for enemy,
and not fighting
> > with
> > > > > you.
> > > > > > > I'm
> > > > > > > > > not
> > > > > > > > > > happy about cases when we are hurrying.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > We can't fix test, fill ticket details,
can't wait for
> > > > > > contributions
> > > > > > > to
> > > > > > > > > > finish their tasks.  It is not best idea
to use
> experience
> > > from
> > > > > > > > > commercial
> > > > > > > > > > companies in open source. Are there any
pressure outside
> > > > > community?
> > > > > > > Did
> > > > > > > > > > someone promised rest of features to be
released at 30
> > > > September?
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Let's remember principle do-orcracy, power
of those who
> do.
> > > If
> > > > > > > > contribor
> > > > > > > > > > does change and reviewer does review, let's
give right of
> > > > making
> > > > > > > > decision
> > > > > > > > > > to them, but not to some closed club of
people who
> > privately
> > > > > > discuss
> > > > > > > > > > something.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Sincerely
> > > > > > > > > > Dmitriy Pavlov
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > чт, 27 сент. 2018 г., 23:42 Vyacheslav
Daradur <
> > > > > > daradurvs@gmail.com
> > > > > > > >:
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Hi Igniters!
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > As I have written about Service Grid
before [1] I'm
> > > > finalizing
> > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > > solution to be sure that implementation
is reliable.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > About including it in 2.7, if we talk
that code freeze
> > > > tomorrow
> > > > > > > then
> > > > > > > > > > > the solution is not ready to merge
yet.
> > > > > > > > > > > I hope that prereviewers Anton Vinogradov
and Nikolay
> > > Izhikov
> > > > > > will
> > > > > > > be
> > > > > > > > > > > able to answer if solution out of scope
or not in a
> > couple
> > > of
> > > > > > days.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > [1]
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> http://apache-ignite-developers.2346864.n4.nabble.com/Apache-Ignite-2-7-release-td34076.html#a34485
> > > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Sep 27, 2018 at 11:14 PM Dmitriy
Pavlov <
> > > > > > > > dpavlov.spb@gmail.com
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, I agree, NPE during WAL flush
is definitely a
> > > blocker.
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > It is strange why the current
test set did not fail
> > after
> > > > > > commit.
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > чт, 27 сент. 2018 г. в
21:45, Andrey Kuznetsov <
> > > > > > > stkuzma@gmail.com
> > > > > > > > >:
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > Igniters,
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > I've bumped into a new bug
in WAL manager recently,
> > see
> > > > > [1].
> > > > > > It
> > > > > > > > > looks
> > > > > > > > > > > > > critical enough, and can
be a good candidate for
> > fixing
> > > > > > before
> > > > > > > > 2.7
> > > > > > > > > > > release.
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > Do you agree?
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > [1]
> > https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/IGNITE-9731
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > чт, 27 сент. 2018 г.
в 19:45, Dmitriy Pavlov <
> > > > > > > > > dpavlov.spb@gmail.com
> > > > > > > > > > >:
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > I need Vhyacheslav's
opinion to be absolutely
> sure
> > > what
> > > > > > > status
> > > > > > > > is
> > > > > > > > > > > now.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > We never committed to
dates of release, as well.
> I
> > > > don't
> > > > > > > quite
> > > > > > > > > > > understand
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > what can mean 'the community
committed to
> > > > doing/releasing
> > > > > > > > > > something'.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > About SG, I also concerned
why such a big feature
> > has
> > > > > > quite a
> > > > > > > > few
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > discussions on the list.
But it is another story.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > чт, 27 сент. 2018
г. в 19:33, Vladimir Ozerov <
> > > > > > > > > > vozerov@gridgain.com
> > > > > > > > > > > >:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Folks,
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please stop looking
for enemies everywhere.
> Just
> > > went
> > > > > > > through
> > > > > > > > > > this
> > > > > > > > > > > > > thread
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and search for
"service" word.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Sep 27,
2018 at 7:30 PM Denis Magda <
> > > > > > > > dmagda@apache.org
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > Denis,
as PMC Chair, could you please
> control,
> > > > that
> > > > > > > > Service
> > > > > > > > > > Grid
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > inclusion/exclusion
is discussed properly
> > > > according
> > > > > to
> > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > > Apache
> > > > > > > > > > > > > Way.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> It's fine when
committers/contributors have
> > > private
> > > > > > > > > discussions
> > > > > > > > > > > > > related
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > to
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> a feature they've
been working on. Not
> > everything
> > > > > should
> > > > > > > go
> > > > > > > > > > > through
> > > > > > > > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> dev
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> list. Otherwise,
it will be inundated.
> However,
> > > > > agree,
> > > > > > > that
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > architectural
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> and release
decisions need to be done
> publicly.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> Speaking about
Service Grid, there was a
> > > discussion
> > > > > > where
> > > > > > > I
> > > > > > > > > saw
> > > > > > > > > > > that
> > > > > > > > > > > > > it
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> was
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> questionable
whether it gets added to the
> > release
> > > or
> > > > > > not.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> *Vladislav*,
could you please shed some light
> on
> > > the
> > > > > > > current
> > > > > > > > > > > status of
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> service grid?
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> On Thu, Sep
27, 2018 at 9:12 AM Dmitriy
> Pavlov <
> > > > > > > > > > > dpavlov.spb@gmail.com
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > Ok, let's
wait for feedback from SG
> > > > > > > Author(s)/Reviewer(s)
> > > > > > > > > > > first. If
> > > > > > > > > > > > > it
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> is
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > not ready,
ok. But I thought it is almost
> > done.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > I apologize
if I missed some discussion (it
> > can
> > > > > > happen),
> > > > > > > > but
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > According
to the statement "our current
> > > agreement"
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > I can
suspect some members are making some
> > sort
> > > of
> > > > > > > private
> > > > > > > > > > > > > agreements,
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> and
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > do not
to discuss it on the list.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > Let's
build consensus here first, and then
> > name
> > > an
> > > > > > > > > agreement.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > Denis,
as PMC Chair, could you please
> control,
> > > > that
> > > > > > > > Service
> > > > > > > > > > Grid
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > inclusion/exclusion
is discussed properly
> > > > according
> > > > > to
> > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > > Apache
> > > > > > > > > > > > > Way.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > чт,
27 сент. 2018 г. в 18:55, Vladimir
> Ozerov
> > <
> > > > > > > > > > > vozerov@gridgain.com
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> Dmitriy,
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >>
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> This
is an outcome of current state of
> > Service
> > > > > Grid -
> > > > > > > it
> > > > > > > > is
> > > > > > > > > > not
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > ready.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> We
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> never
committed to have it to 2.7. Our goal
> > was
> > > > to
> > > > > > try
> > > > > > > to
> > > > > > > > > > > include
> > > > > > > > > > > > > it
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> into
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> 2.7.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >>
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> On
Thu, Sep 27, 2018 at 6:48 PM Dmitriy
> > Pavlov
> > > <
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > dpavlov.spb@gmail.com>
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >>
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
Could you please provide a reference to
> > some
> > > > > > thread?
> > > > > > > > > > > Probably I
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> missed
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> it.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
чт, 27 сент. 2018 г. в 18:46, Vladimir
> > > Ozerov <
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > vozerov@gridgain.com
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
> Our current agreement is that Service
> > Grid
> > > is
> > > > > out
> > > > > > > of
> > > > > > > > > > scope.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > This
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> is a
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
huge
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
> feature, which hasn't entered review
> > stage
> > > so
> > > > > > far,
> > > > > > > We
> > > > > > > > > > will
> > > > > > > > > > > not
> > > > > > > > > > > > > be
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> able
to
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
> review/fix/test it properly.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
>
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
> On Thu, Sep 27, 2018 at 6:32 PM Dmitriy
> > > > Pavlov
> > > > > <
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> dpavlov.spb@gmail.com
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
>
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
> > I agree, and I prefer four weeks for
> > > > > > > stabilization*
> > > > > > > > > (1
> > > > > > > > > > > Oct -
> > > > > > > > > > > > > 29
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> Oct)
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
> >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
> > Do I understand it correctly: Service
> > > Grid
> > > > is
> > > > > > > still
> > > > > > > > > in
> > > > > > > > > > > scope,
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> isn't
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
it? I
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
> > find it very important.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
> >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
> > чт, 27 сент. 2018 г. в 18:28, Nikolay
> > > > > Izhikov <
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> nizhikov@apache.org
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
> >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
> > > Hello, Vova.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
> > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
> > > Thank you for clear release status.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
> > > I'm +1 for your proposal.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
> > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
> > > чт, 27 сент. 2018 г., 18:25 Alexey
> > > > > Kuznetsov
> > > > > > <
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> akuznetsov@apache.org
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
>:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
> > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
> > > > Vova,
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
> > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
> > > > Huge +1 to do a stabilization.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
> > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
> > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
> > > > --
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
> > > > Alexey Kuznetsov
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
> > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
> > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
> >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
>
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >> >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >>
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards,
> > > > > > > > > > > > >   Andrey Kuznetsov.
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > > > > > Best Regards, Vyacheslav D.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
>

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