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From Joe Schaefer <>
Subject Re: httpd has no reason to improve...
Date Mon, 22 Aug 2005 19:59:13 GMT
Paul A Houle <> writes:

>    I don't see excellence coming from "swiss army knife" frameworks 
> that do everything,  but from systems that are developed from a whole 
> system viewpoint,  that have a good amount of codesign between layers of 
> the system -- if you build a system that lets you plug in arbitrary 
> junk,  you're going to get arbitrary performance and reliability.

I don't think the ASF infrastructure team feels that way
about qpsmtpd + mod_perl.  Without mod_perl, qpsmtpd simply
couldn't handle our load.  With mod_perl, it handles the load 
rather easily.  The glue code to hook qpsmtpd into mod_perl is 
rather small.

I consider that a remarkable real-world success of the 2.x 
architecture, warts and all.


>    Were Apache development targeting real problems that real users 
> have,  I think things would be quite different. 

My point remains this: we target power users, because those are 
the people that contribute to the project.  Mass-virtual-hosting 
ISP's rarely have anything to contribute here; yet they form the 
dominant portion of our "market share".

>    A big part of the problem is that the Apache project has settled 
> into a local equilibrium -- this explains the paradox of a product that 
> obviously satisfies end user's needs well (no competition has emerged) 
> but has a moribund development process.  Any real innovation in the web 
> server space will need to be disruptive,  to break things.  Apache,  as 
> we know it,  just can't do that.

As an apreq developer, I couldn't disagree more.  2.0 solved our
real-world problems that *our* users face, because it allows better
modularity.  No longer do apreq users have to use apreq consistently
throughout their codebase in order to reap its benefits.

Joe Schaefer

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