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From "William A. Rowe, Jr." <>
Subject Re: Thread-unsafe libraries in httpd-2.0
Date Fri, 16 Aug 2002 15:13:04 GMT
At 09:41 AM 8/16/2002, Rodent of Unusual Size wrote:
>We had this discussion elsewhere, but just for the record..
>Justin Erenkrantz wrote:
> >
> > And, my point back to you is that should be part of the documentation
> > of the module NOT of httpd-2.0.
>IMNSHO, that is *such* BS.  If someone has a working Web server
>and upgrades following our recommendations, and things stop working,
>it's not PHP that will get blamed.  PHP still works just fine; there
>always has been the potential for trouble with threaded libraries, but
>that wasn't an issue because the Web server didn't use threads.

And what was said elsewhere by someone else [not me] is that we've
warned folks for THREE YEARS that Apache 2.0 would be threaded.

>What changed?  The Web server; it started supporting threads.  So it
>behooves the Web server to document the potential for problems.

Document them *where*?  As was pointed out on another list, quit
bitching about it and propose docs-patches that would make you

>Why should the burden be put on PHP, or any other module for that
>matter?  *They* weren't the ones that enabled threading.

And they only had three years to prepare.

The problems are not with PHP or with mod_perl, both support threading,
and are thread-safe themselves.

So now, what libraries are broken?  That is what Rasmus, Justin, Doug
and others are going to the trouble to research.  So stop  accusing our 
researcher/volunteers of BS, and quit spreading FUD yourself.

If your module isn't threadsafe, check the mpm for threading support
and bail.  If your module *might* be threadsafe, but might not because
of 3p modules, check the mpm for threading support and throw a
warning.  And once we finish preparing a list of known-thread-safe
libraries/versions (and how to detect which version of each is present)
we can go as far as warning the user that a specific library is known
to be thread-unsafe and emit very loud build and run time warnings.

Step one is research.  Quit pissing off the researchers with your
pronouncements from on high :-)


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