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From "Ralf S. Engelschall" <>
Subject Re: Suggestion: shtool
Date Fri, 23 Apr 1999 21:37:24 GMT

In article <> you wrote:
> Ralf S. Engelschall wrote:
>> I've released shtool now as a stand-alone package because one finally has stop
>> reinventing the wheel for each package and then maintaining such scripts at
>> all packages locally. We did this now for years and it's a waste of time and
>> leads just to hundred variants of a script, each containing different
>> bugfixes. I want to centralize this script hacking with shtool a little bit
>> now...
> I'll be honest. I'm a bit uncomfortable with the way shtool is presented.
> The tools in shtools have been worked on by many people, both in and
> outside of AG. I'm uncomfortable with the idea of reformating them
> and then repackaging them and having (c) Ralf S. Engelschall on them.
> Apache will not, and can not, continue in a volunteer basis if people
> are afraid of submitting something neat, and someone changing the
> indentation and releasing it as their "own" product. Yes, I know
> what LICENSE says. I mean appearances, esp for those _in_ AG, are
> very important. What would people say or think if, using Ben L's
> analogy, I went ahead and combined all of the Apache source into
> apache.c, used tabs as normal people do :), and then created my
> own LICENSE that included the single-line acknowledgement of
> AG, and then replacing all occurances of Apache with Jim Jagielski ?
> True, this is an overblown case, but I hope the point is clear.

Hmm... I'm a bit surprised: The only script which wasn't written by me is which is actually just derived and cleaned up from the Apache
GuessOS. But it explicitly contains:

##  Copyright (c) 1996-1999 The Apache Group,
##  The Apache license applies (see

And even the LICENSE file contains for it:

  This product includes software developed by the Apache Group
  for use in the Apache HTTP server project (

But _all_ other scripts were written originally by me and just ported over to
Apache for APACI one year ago. I've not even overtaken your new or
our PrintPath, Jim! So I'm a little bit surprised why you feel such
uncomfortable with shtool. Only 10% of it is from the Apache Group and this
10% get explicit credit and fulfill the requirements of the Apache license

Hmmm... are you really sure you've looked at the various *.sh scripts of
shtool in detail, Jim?
                                       Ralf S. Engelschall

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