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From Ian Kluft <>
Subject Re: [2.0 API] update to "apigen" script
Date Wed, 11 Jun 1997 19:02:46 GMT
> From: "Roy T. Fielding" <fielding@kiwi.ICS.UCI.EDU>
> I've read through Ian's proposal and I have a few comments (and a little
> better understanding of why Jim got snippy).  I think its great that
> you've come up with an interesting idea and are gung-ho towards
> contributing to Apache, but you can't expect the group to buy off on
> these things without some serious thought about where we want to go
> first, and that takes time (weeks, not days).  Up until June 4, most
> of us were observing the moratorium against talking about 1.2 on the
> main list.  Also, please understand that those of us who spent huge gobs
> of time doing the testing/bug-fixing/problem-report-handling/documenting
> and planning of the six month beta cycle are somewhat leery of people
> who wait until the sexy design stuff begins before they start contributing.
> Apache is not just a software project; it is a community, and it takes
> a certain amount of time to gain the trust of a community.
> [...]

Yes, yes, I've been given that lecture several times.  The problem is that
I was trying to do exactly that... establish some trust.  When these ideas
were bouncing around in May, I was seeking a way to abstract the
authentication and hash-lookup back-ends for some modules I've written
for internal use at work.

As I followed more people's suggestions, it grew.  Then I was told, "it
sounds like vaporware.  We'll take it more seriously when there's something
to look at."  I posted some updates along the way and even made major course
corrections based on the input that some people sent me.  I took that
seriously but it turned out to offend others in the group.  It was a no-win

My sincere apologies to everyone.  I hope it's clear that I was acting on
the suggestions of some in the group... suggestions that were obviously not
agreed by all.

On the other hand, trust is a two-way thing.  This entire event has hurt my
previouslyr-high opinion of the Apache Group.  Having been tarred and
feathered by some in the group for following the suggestions of others in
the group is frustrating.  Trust has not (yet) been established in either
Ian Kluft  KO6YQ PP-ASEL                                  Cisco Systems, Inc. (work) (home)          San Jose, CA

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