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From "Morozova, Nadezhda" <nadezhda.moroz...@intel.com>
Subject RE: Re: [doc][drlvm] The document "Getting started with DRL" is outdated
Date Tue, 14 Nov 2006 06:27:05 GMT
Pavel,
Thanks for your comments. I'll work through the examples and post an
updated patch soon. 
As for the Configuring VM operation - can we at least have a couple of
examples in the form of scenarios or something? The wiki page only gives
a reference, an enumeration of available options. Using these might not
always be transparent. I know it's tutorial-level info, but why not have
it? Giving a show-case of customizing vm to a specific need would be
great. 

Thank you, 
Nadya Morozova
 
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Pavel Ozhdikhin [mailto:pavel.ozhdikhin@gmail.com]
>Sent: Tuesday, November 14, 2006 9:23 AM
>To: harmony-dev@incubator.apache.org
>Subject: Re: Re: [doc][drlvm] The document "Getting started with DRL"
is
>outdated
>
>Nadya,
>
>I've looked through your patch. Please see my comments in JIRA:
>http://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/HARMONY-2150
>
>> Do you think we can add a link to debugging vm&jit doc (or to wiki)?
>
>I don't think we need it - it is rather info for developers than for
users.
>
>> Any ideas on what to write in Configuring vm operation?
>
>This section will duplicate the info from the Wiki page. Since we gave
a
>link to that page in the "overview" we may skip creation of a separate
>section here.
>
>Thanks,
>Pavel
>
>
>On 11/13/06, Morozova, Nadezhda <nadezhda.morozova@intel.com> wrote:
>>
>> Successfully added a patch to fix getting Started outdated content to
>> http://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/HARMONY-2150.
>> The patch is not final - need help to add more content. The current
>> structure is:
>> - overview
>> - running an app
>> - eclipse-related (now much shorter)
>>        -- running an app
>>        -- debugging an app
>> - configuring vm operation (empty)
>>
>> Questions: how do you like the current patch? Do you think we can add
a
>> link to debugging vm&jit doc (or to wiki)? Any ideas on what to write
in
>> Configuring vm operation?
>>
>> Thank you,
>> Nadya Morozova
>>
>> >-----Original Message-----
>> >From: news [mailto:news@sea.gmane.org] On Behalf Of Egor Pasko
>> >Sent: Monday, November 13, 2006 1:00 PM
>> >To: harmony-dev@incubator.apache.org
>> >Subject: Re: [doc][drlvm] The document "Getting started with DRL" is
>> >outdated
>> >
>> >On the 0x220 day of Apache Harmony Nadezhda Morozova wrote:
>> >> >-----Original Message-----
>> >> >From: news [mailto:news@sea.gmane.org] On Behalf Of Egor Pasko
>> >> >Sent: Monday, November 13, 2006 12:40 PM
>> >> >To: harmony-dev@incubator.apache.org
>> >> >Subject: Re: [doc][drlvm] The document "Getting started with DRL"
is
>> >> >outdated
>> >> >
>> >> >On the 0x220 day of Apache Harmony Nadezhda Morozova wrote:
>> >> >> Ok,
>> >> >> I'll use http://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/HARMONY-2150 to
get
>> an
>> >> >> initial patch for the getting started document, and we can then
>> work
>> >> to
>> >> >> improve it.
>> >> >
>> >> >OK, I am "watching" it
>> >> >
>> >> >> Let's make it a short page with links to wiki and maybe some
>> how-tos.
>> >> >
>> >> >To summarize:
>> >> >* we agreed that there will be no eclipse screenshots (they are
for
>> >> >  eclipse+drlvm page)
>> >> >* we agreed that there should be something like "see what kind of
>> >> >  links we have"
>> >> >
>> >> >Am I right?
>> >>
>> >> [Nadya]
>> >> Yop, quite right. An additional enhancement would be to comment
out
>> >> copyrights and update info that is incorrect.
>> >
>> >remove these annoyed substances? I am not an expert in copyright
law,
>> >not sure we can remove them. But copyright notices are not what I
>> >desire to look at on the "getting started" page.
>> >
>> >> Not sure I'll fix everything, but can give a start. Thanks for all
>> your
>> >> help.
>> >
>> >u r welcome
>> >
>> >> >
>> >> >> Thank you,
>> >> >> Nadya Morozova
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> -----Original Message-----
>> >> >> From: news [mailto:news@sea.gmane.org] On Behalf Of Egor Pasko
>> >> >> Sent: Monday, November 13, 2006 11:10 AM
>> >> >> To: harmony-dev@incubator.apache.org
>> >> >> Subject: Re: [doc][drlvm] The document "Getting started with
DRL"
>> is
>> >> >> outdated
>> >> >>
>> >> >> On the 0x21D day of Apache Harmony Nadezhda Morozova wrote:
>> >> >> > Egor,
>> >> >> > I think we're mixing things up a bit, or at least our
>> perceptions
>> >> of
>> >> >> > various docs. I'd not call what you're suggesting a tutorial
-
>> it's
>> >> >> more
>> >> >> > of a howto doc, right? We are lucky to have Salikh write this
>> "How
>> >> to
>> >> >> > write a GC?" Doc - do you mean something similar for "DRLVM
>> >> >> Command-line
>> >> >> > Args Tutorial"?
>> >> >>
>> >> >> on Wikipedia:
>> >> >> * A _how-to_ is an informal, often short, description of how to
>> >> >> accomplish
>> >> >>   some specific task
>> >> >> * A _tutorial_ is a document, software, or other media created
for
>> >> the
>> >> >>   purpose of instruction for any of a wide variety of tasks
>> >> >>
>> >> >> yes, I mix those terms :)
>> >> >>
>> >> >> > As suggested earlier, we can store drlvm+eclipse specifics on
>> >> another
>> >> >> > page = see JIRA 2009. cmd options reference is on wiki, but a
>> short
>> >> >> > howto will be marvelous - illustrating usage of common
options,
>> >> >> solving
>> >> >> > typical problems by using our vm correctly, etc.
>> >> >> > Does anybody volunteer to help?
>> >> >>
>> >> >> let's collect the options first. To choose between them for the
>> howto
>> >> >>
>> >> >> > Thank you,
>> >> >> > Nadya Morozova
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > -----Original Message-----
>> >> >> > From: news [mailto:news@sea.gmane.org] On Behalf Of Egor
Pasko
>> >> >> > Sent: Friday, November 10, 2006 4:06 PM
>> >> >> > To: harmony-dev@incubator.apache.org
>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [doc][drlvm] The document "Getting started with
>> DRL"
>> >> is
>> >> >> > outdated
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > On the 0x21D day of Apache Harmony Nadezhda Morozova wrote:
>> >> >> > > Alexei,
>> >> >> > > Tutorials might be fine for mature projects, but I do not
>> think
>> >> ours
>> >> >> > is
>> >> >> > > ready for a big flow of users yet, that would require a
>> tutorial.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > we _are_ mature for a small tutorial :)
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > > So +1 for having a nice good  tutorial ... one day.
>> >> >> > > If there are volunteers to write the tutorial now, I'd be
>> happy
>> >> to
>> >> >> > help
>> >> >> > > though.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > well, actually, I love tutorials too, especially the one for
VIM
>> :)
>> >> >> > some contraversal inside me..fighting..done
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > let's then say "A Short Eclipse Tutorial with Harmony", and
then
>> >> >> > "DRLVM Command-line Args Tutorial". Howabout that?
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > > Thank you,
>> >> >> > > Nadya Morozova
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> > > -----Original Message-----
>> >> >> > > From: Fedotov, Alexei A [mailto:alexei.a.fedotov@intel.com]
>> >> >> > > Sent: Friday, November 10, 2006 1:40 PM
>> >> >> > > To: harmony-dev@incubator.apache.org
>> >> >> > > Subject: RE: Re: [doc][drlvm] The document "Getting started
>> with
>> >> >> DRL"
>> >> >> > is
>> >> >> > > outdated
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> > > Guys,
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> > > I like good tutorials. I learned VIM using a tutorial. I
don't
>> >> need
>> >> >> > the
>> >> >> > > VIM tutorial any longer, but at the beginning it was
useful.
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> > >       +1 for maintain Getting Started as is with minor
changes
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> > > Why Eclipse was chosen for the tutorial? Our goal was to
use
>> >> Harmony
>> >> >> > for
>> >> >> > > Harmony development. I liked that idea.
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> > > With best regards,
>> >> >> > > Alexei Fedotov,
>> >> >> > > Intel Java & XML Engineering
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> > > >-----Original Message-----
>> >> >> > > >From: news [mailto:news@sea.gmane.org] On Behalf Of Egor
>> Pasko
>> >> >> > > >Sent: Friday, November 10, 2006 1:29 PM
>> >> >> > > >To: harmony-dev@incubator.apache.org
>> >> >> > > >Subject: Re: [doc][drlvm] The document "Getting started
with
>> >> DRL"
>> >> >> is
>> >> >> > > >outdated
>> >> >> > > >
>> >> >> > > >On the 0x21D day of Apache Harmony Pavel Ozhdikhin wrote:
>> >> >> > > >> Nadya,
>> >> >> > > >>
>> >> >> > > >> One more proposal about "Getting Started": let's remove
all
>> >> >> current
>> >> >> > > >content
>> >> >> > > >> and write something like following:
>> >> >> > > >>
>> >> >> > > >> "To the moment we got rid of all major differences from
>> other
>> >> >> Java
>> >> >> > > >> implementations, so to use DRLVM you can just build it
>> (here
>> >> goes
>> >> >> > > link to
>> >> >> > > >> readme with build instructions) and run as any other
Java
>> VM.
>> >> For
>> >> >> > > >commonly
>> >> >> > > >> used command-line options please look into the Wiki page
>> (link
>> >> to
>> >> >> > > >Salikh's
>> >> >> > > >> page or to the document)."
>> >> >> > > >>
>> >> >> > > >> What do you think?
>> >> >> > > >
>> >> >> > > >1 page to hold only 4 lines of text? :)
>> >> >> > > >
>> >> >> > > >> Thanks,
>> >> >> > > >> Pavel
>> >> >> > > >>
>> >> >> > > >>
>> >> >> > > >> On 10 Nov 2006 14:29:59 +0600, Egor Pasko
>> >> <egor.pasko@gmail.com>
>> >> >> > > wrote:
>> >> >> > > >> >
>> >> >> > > >> > On the 0x21D day of Apache Harmony Nadezhda Morozova
>> wrote:
>> >> >> > > >> > > Good day to you, Egor!
>> >> >> > > >> >
>> >> >> > > >> > evening, dark and snowy evening :)
>> >> >> > > >> >
>> >> >> > > >> > > What do you say about the getting started doc?
>> >> >> > > >> >
>> >> >> > > >> > I expressed it recently. General idea is that Harmony
>> >> operates
>> >> >> > near
>> >> >> > > >> > the same as other JSE implementations. Almost all
>> specifics
>> >> is
>> >> >> in
>> >> >> > > >> > extra options which we started collecting on Wiki for
an
>> >> extra
>> >> >> > > >> > HOWTO-like page (BTW, thanks to Salikh for starting
the
>> >> page).
>> >> >> > > >> >
>> >> >> > > >> > I believe, it is time to remove the "Getting Started".
>> So,
>> >> +1
>> >> >> to
>> >> >> > > Pavel
>> >> >> > > >> > Ozhdikhin here.
>> >> >> > > >> >
>> >> >> > > >> > BTW, I asked my dad to look at the website. Ideas for
>> >> >> improvement
>> >> >> > > from
>> >> >> > > >> > him:
>> >> >> > > >> > 1) site-local search is useful for a beginner. Hm,
Tomcat
>> >> has
>> >> >> it
>> >> >> > > with
>> >> >> > > >> > links to google search. We can have something as soon
as
>> we
>> >> get
>> >> >> > to
>> >> >> > > the
>> >> >> > > >> > desired TLP :)
>> >> >> > > >> > 2) it is not obvious that site misprints/problems
should
>> be
>> >> >> > > reported
>> >> >> > > >> > to the mailing list. Commercial websites have
something
>> like
>> >> >> > > >> > "support/suggestions mailto". We can point mailto to
the
>> >> >> mailing
>> >> >> > > list
>> >> >> > > >:)
>> >> >> > > >> >
>> >> >> > > >> > > Thank you,
>> >> >> > > >> > > Nadya Morozova
>> >> >> > > >> > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > -----Original Message-----
>> >> >> > > >> > > From: news [mailto:news@sea.gmane.org] On Behalf Of
>> Egor
>> >> >> Pasko
>> >> >> > > >> > > Sent: Friday, November 10, 2006 8:55 AM
>> >> >> > > >> > > To: harmony-dev@incubator.apache.org
>> >> >> > > >> > > Subject: Re: [doc][drlvm] The document "Getting
started
>> >> with
>> >> >> > DRL"
>> >> >> > > is
>> >> >> > > >> > > outdated
>> >> >> > > >> > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > On the 0x21D day of Apache Harmony Nadezhda Morozova
>> >> wrote:
>> >> >> > > >> > > > Egor,
>> >> >> > > >> > > > I generally like the idea of improving navigation
>> over
>> >> the
>> >> >> > site
>> >> >> > > -
>> >> >> > > >> > > > there's never too much of that. However, I am not
>> sure
>> >> >> > whether
>> >> >> > > we
>> >> >> > > >need
>> >> >> > > >> > > > yet another separate page for
introductory/guidance
>> >> info. I
>> >> >> > > hope
>> >> >> > > >the
>> >> >> > > >> > > > starting page + the generic pages we have are
mostly
>> >> fine.
>> >> >> > > However,
>> >> >> > > >> > > > adding a link here and there to lead site
visitors.
>> >> >> > > >> > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > Getting started could be a more specific
>> >> project-oriented
>> >> >> > page.
>> >> >> > > >There,
>> >> >> > > >> > > > you can tell people to go <link>download</link>,
>> >> >> > > <link>build</link>
>> >> >> > > >> > > the
>> >> >> > > >> > > > code. After which, they can start using it just as
>> any
>> >> >> other
>> >> >> > > >> > > > <link>RI-compatible</link> jdk. With the
exceptions,
>> see
>> >> >> our
>> >> >> > > >> > > > <link>wiki</link> pages.
>> >> >> > > >> > > > To use the vm, readers might need to use the
>> following
>> >> >> > > options...
>> >> >> > > >> > > > If they want to read more on our VM, they can
visit
>> the
>> >> >> > > >> > > > <link>component</link> page. If no website page
>> contains
>> >> an
>> >> >> > > answer
>> >> >> > > >-
>> >> >> > > >> > > > they can read <link>wiki faqa</link>.
>> >> >> > > >> > > > .. or something like that :)
>> >> >> > > >> > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > Nadya, I really appreciate our efforts :) But this
>> morning
>> >> I
>> >> >> > woke
>> >> >> > > up
>> >> >> > > >> > > and looked the site structure with the eye of a
>> beginner.
>> >> And
>> >> >> > > could
>> >> >> > > >> > > not find any obvius flaws in the main structure.
>> Left-side
>> >> >> > > collection
>> >> >> > > >> > > of links is in a very good shape, good for
>> beginner-level
>> >> >> > > navigation
>> >> >> > > >> > > and contains almost all links you listed here.
>> >> >> > > >> > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > This was a really refreshing morning :)
>> >> >> > > >> > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > I'll ask some guys who are new to the project, how
they
>> >> feel
>> >> >> > > about
>> >> >> > > >the
>> >> >> > > >> > > site. And will report back, if I find something.
>> >> >> > > >> > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > Refreshing morning is over, now back to work..
>> >> >> > > >> > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > Thank you,
>> >> >> > > >> > > > Nadya Morozova
>> >> >> > > >> > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > -----Original Message-----
>> >> >> > > >> > > > From: news [mailto:news@sea.gmane.org] On Behalf
Of
>> Egor
>> >> >> > Pasko
>> >> >> > > >> > > > Sent: Thursday, November 09, 2006 5:33 PM
>> >> >> > > >> > > > To: harmony-dev@incubator.apache.org
>> >> >> > > >> > > > Subject: Re: [doc][drlvm] The document "Getting
>> started
>> >> >> with
>> >> >> > > DRL"
>> >> >> > > >is
>> >> >> > > >> > > > outdated
>> >> >> > > >> > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > On the 0x21C day of Apache Harmony Pavel Ozhdikhin
>> >> wrote:
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > On 11/9/06, Morozova, Nadezhda
>> >> >> > <nadezhda.morozova@intel.com>
>> >> >> > > >wrote:
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > Egor,
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > +1 for
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > Just idea: "Getting Started" may contain a
>> >> collection
>> >> >> of
>> >> >> > > links
>> >> >> > > >to
>> >> >> > > >> > > > the
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > main website and other resources with short
>> >> >> descriptions
>> >> >> > > ("Site
>> >> >> > > >> > > Map"
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > or something) so that people are comfortable
>> >> floating
>> >> >> > > around in
>> >> >> > > >> > > the
>> >> >> > > >> > > > web.
>> >> >> > > >> > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > We already have one page having links to the
>> resources
>> >> >> > about
>> >> >> > > >DRLVM:
>> >> >> > > >> > > > >
>> >> >> > >
>> >>
>http://incubator.apache.org/harmony/subcomponents/drlvm/index.html
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > Why do you think we need another one?
>> >> >> > > >> > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > because it is only DRLVM.
>> >> >> > > >> > > > I think of something like "site map", a collection
of
>> >> >> links.
>> >> >> > > Short
>> >> >> > > >> > > > descriptions to some basic ones.
>> >> >> > > >> > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > +1 for
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > * preparing the "Commonly Used Options for
DRLVM"
>> >> >> > (omitting
>> >> >> > > the
>> >> >> > > >> > > word
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > "supported" intentionally)
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > Question on this one: will the page contain
>> vm-only
>> >> >> > > options?
>> >> >> > > >What
>> >> >> > > >> > > > about
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > JIT, GC, other? I'd have them all in one
place,
>> but
>> >> we
>> >> >> > have
>> >> >> > > >> > > separate
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > docs for EM/jit stuff. What do you say?
>> >> >> > > >> > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > I think we can describe basic options for every
>> >> component
>> >> >> > > there.
>> >> >> > > >> > > Only
>> >> >> > > >> > > > those
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > that might be interesting for any user. The
place
>> for
>> >> >> other
>> >> >> > > >options
>> >> >> > > >> > > is
>> >> >> > > >> > > > in
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > the run-time help or Developer's Guide for a
>> >> component.
>> >> >> > > >> > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > I thought of "most commonly used" options. They
can
>> >> >> possibly
>> >> >> > be
>> >> >> > > >> > > > grouped by components, but not necessary. I would
>> group
>> >> >> them
>> >> >> > by
>> >> >> > > >> > > > use-cases. BTW, "any user" is not an obvious
>> substance
>> >> for
>> >> >> > me.
>> >> >> > > >> > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > So, the list is not obvious, we need to work it
out.
>> >> >> > > >> > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > I see it like HOWTOs. For example:
>> >> >> > > >> > > > "-Xem:jet <- use only baseline JIT compiler"
>> >> >> > > >> > > > "-Xem:opt <- use only optimising JIT compiler"
>> >> >> > > >> > > > "-Xtrace:em <- print method compilation events"
>> >> >> > > >> > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > The 'big' question is: "does 'any user' need to
know
>> >> about
>> >> >> > JITs
>> >> >> > > >> > > > switching?". I say YES, it helps users to
investigate
>> >> >> > problems,
>> >> >> > > >which
>> >> >> > > >> > > > helps us, developers, to react on users' input
>> faster.
>> >> >> > > >> > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > Other options? I can enlist the set of most
commonly
>> >> used
>> >> >> by
>> >> >> > > me. If
>> >> >> > > >> > > > many of us put their lists here, we can sum them
up
>> >> quickly
>> >> >> > and
>> >> >> > > >make
>> >> >> > > >> > > > a good (really useful) list of popular options.
How
>> >> about
>> >> >> > that?
>> >> >> > > >> > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > BTW, the list should not be too big. 25 options is
a
>> >> kind
>> >> >> of
>> >> >> > > limit
>> >> >> > > >> > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > Thanks,
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > Pavel
>> >> >> > > >> > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > Thank you,
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > Nadya Morozova
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > -----Original Message-----
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > From: news [mailto:news@sea.gmane.org] On
Behalf
>> Of
>> >> >> Egor
>> >> >> > > Pasko
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > Sent: Thursday, November 09, 2006 5:51 AM
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > To: harmony-dev@incubator.apache.org
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > Subject: Re: [doc][drlvm] The document
"Getting
>> >> started
>> >> >> > > with
>> >> >> > > >DRL"
>> >> >> > > >> > > is
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > outdated
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > On the 0x21B day of Apache Harmony Nadezhda
>> Morozova
>> >> >> > wrote:
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > All,
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > I'd like to share everyone's grief at the
sight
>> of
>> >> >> > > outdated
>> >> >> > > >> > > > Getting
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > Started document. However, I'd not hurry to
>> >> eliminate
>> >> >> > the
>> >> >> > > >page
>> >> >> > > >> > > as
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > such.
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > We might reconsider some of its contents,
>> change
>> >> >> > > structure,
>> >> >> > > >and
>> >> >> > > >> > > > update
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > individual bits, but please think carefully
>> before
>> >> >> > > removing
>> >> >> > > >the
>> >> >> > > >> > > > page.
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > I think Getting Started (as the title shows)
is
>> >> aimed
>> >> >> > to
>> >> >> > > help
>> >> >> > > >a
>> >> >> > > >> > > > newbie
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > work with our vm. I know that many primarily
>> >> >> interested
>> >> >> > > in
>> >> >> > > >other
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > things
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > - conformance, architecture, internal
>> specifics.
>> >> >> > However,
>> >> >> > > we
>> >> >> > > >> > > > should
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > also
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > think how the vm is used. AFAIK, Getting
>> started
>> >> is
>> >> >> now
>> >> >> > > the
>> >> >> > > >> > > *only*
>> >> >> > > >> > > > doc
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > that tries to show how to use our vm. You
tell
>> >> people
>> >> >> > how
>> >> >> > > to
>> >> >> > > >> > > > download
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > and build, but almost nothing about how to
run
>> and
>> >> >> > > configure
>> >> >> > > >> > > (with
>> >> >> > > >> > > > the
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > exception of EM/JIT).
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > My suggestion would be to think of what you
>> want
>> >> to
>> >> >> > tell
>> >> >> > > >people
>> >> >> > > >> > > > about
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > usage - with or without eclipse specifics.
And
>> >> store
>> >> >> > this
>> >> >> > > >info
>> >> >> > > >> > > on
>> >> >> > > >> > > > the
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > page. I know it is hard - and I offer my
help
>> and
>> >> >> > support
>> >> >> > > in
>> >> >> > > >> > > this
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > burdensome initiative. Any thoughts? i might
be
>> >> >> > > inobjective
>> >> >> > > >and
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > emotional :)
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > Nadya,
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > I believe, almost everyone coming across
Harmony
>> >> knows
>> >> >> > how
>> >> >> > > to
>> >> >> > > >use
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > J5SE. We are striving for this compatibility,
and
>> we
>> >> >> are
>> >> >> > > happy
>> >> >> > > >> > > that
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > all DRLVM-specific pecularities are gone.
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > So, I vote for:
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > * removing the "Getting Started" (also because
of
>> >> >> > > irritating
>> >> >> > > >> > > windows
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > screenshots:)
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > * preparing the "Commonly Used Options for
DRLVM"
>> >> >> > (omitting
>> >> >> > > the
>> >> >> > > >> > > word
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > "supported" intentionally)
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > Just idea: "Getting Started" may contain a
>> >> collection
>> >> >> of
>> >> >> > > links
>> >> >> > > >to
>> >> >> > > >> > > > the
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > main website and other resources with short
>> >> >> descriptions
>> >> >> > > ("Site
>> >> >> > > >> > > Map"
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > or something) so that people are comfortable
>> >> floating
>> >> >> > > around in
>> >> >> > > >> > > the
>> >> >> > > >> > > > web.
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > -----Original Message-----
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > From: Mikhail Fursov
>> >> [mailto:mike.fursov@gmail.com]
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, November 08, 2006 6:03 PM
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > To: harmony-dev@incubator.apache.org
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > Subject: Re: [doc][drlvm] The document
"Getting
>> >> >> started
>> >> >> > > with
>> >> >> > > >> > > DRL"
>> >> >> > > >> > > > is
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > outdated
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > It's not a hard to write a documenation
once,
>> it's
>> >> >> hard
>> >> >> > > to
>> >> >> > > >> > > support
>> >> >> > > >> > > > it
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > :)
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > More problems:
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > 1) -Xem options are obsolete.
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > 2) -Xjit options are also obsolete.
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > 3) Do we really need this page today? AFAIU
>> users
>> >> >> > expect
>> >> >> > > >Harmony
>> >> >> > > >> > > > VM is
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > able
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > to run the same apps as RI..
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > ?
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > On 11/8/06, Pavel Ozhdikhin
>> >> >> <pavel.ozhdikhin@gmail.com>
>> >> >> > > >wrote:
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > > Hello all,
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > > I've read through the "Getting Started
with
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > > DRL<
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > >
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >>
>> >>
>>
>http://incubator.apache.org/harmony/subcomponents/drlvm/getting_started
>> >> >> > > .
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > html
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > > >"
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > > document on the Harmony web and found it
>> >> completely
>> >> >> > > >outdated,
>> >> >> > > >> > > > for
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > example:
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > >    - the term DRL is used instead of DRLVM
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > >    - eclipse.bat and eclipse.sh are
obsolete
>> -
>> >> we
>> >> >> > don't
>> >> >> > > >need
>> >> >> > > >> > > > them
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > anymore
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > >    to run Eclipse. It can be started with
>> DRLVM
>> >> the
>> >> >> > > same
>> >> >> > > >way
>> >> >> > > >> > > as
>> >> >> > > >> > > > with
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > any
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > > other
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > >    VM.
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > >    - We don't need to set PATH and
>> >> LD_LIBRARY_PATH
>> >> >> > > anymore,
>> >> >> > > >at
>> >> >> > > >> > > > least
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > on
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > >    Windows/MSVC
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > >    - ij was renamed to java
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > > We took a big step to unification with
other
>> >> Java
>> >> >> VMs
>> >> >> > > and
>> >> >> > > >now
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > > we don't need anything specific to run
>> Eclipse,
>> >> for
>> >> >> > > >example.
>> >> >> > > >> > > > After
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > > removing
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > > all irrelevant info the document would
>> contain
>> >> only
>> >> >> > the
>> >> >> > > >list
>> >> >> > > >> > > of
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > > command-line
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > > options. I think we can move this list to
a
>> >> >> separate
>> >> >> > > >document
>> >> >> > > >> > > > (Wiki,
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > > Developer's Guide?) and remove the
"Getting
>> >> >> Started"
>> >> >> > > >itself.
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > > Any opinions?
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > > Thanks,
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > > Pavel
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > > <
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > >
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >>
>> >>
>>
>http://incubator.apache.org/harmony/subcomponents/drlvm/getting_started
>> >> >> > > .
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > html
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > --
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > > Mikhail Fursov
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > --
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > > Egor Pasko
>> >> >> > > >> > > > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > > --
>> >> >> > > >> > > > Egor Pasko
>> >> >> > > >> > > >
>> >> >> > > >> > >
>> >> >> > > >> > > --
>> >> >> > > >> > > Egor Pasko
>> >> >> > > >> > >
>> >> >> > > >> >
>> >> >> > > >> > --
>> >> >> > > >> > Egor Pasko
>> >> >> > > >> >
>> >> >> > > >> >
>> >> >> > > >
>> >> >> > > >--
>> >> >> > > >Egor Pasko
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > --
>> >> >> > Egor Pasko
>> >> >> >
>> >> >>
>> >> >> --
>> >> >> Egor Pasko
>> >> >>
>> >> >
>> >> >--
>> >> >Egor Pasko
>> >>
>> >
>> >--
>> >Egor Pasko
>>

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