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From Geir Magnusson Jr <g...@pobox.com>
Subject Re: [general] Sun's permission to use exception messages and toString() formats
Date Mon, 07 Aug 2006 11:12:05 GMT


Mikhail Loenko wrote:
> Does it mean that we are revisiting our agreement on "more helpful error
> messages"? [1,2]

They are orthogonal.  I think that Mark was right on that our message
all over should be helpful, but then when we are throwing exceptions out
of standard classes, we need to take some care.

> 
> Should we now roll back for example Harmony-250?

I don't think so - did it actually undo RI-like exception messages, or
just improve some?

geir

> 
> Thanks,
> Mikhail
> 
> [1]
> http://incubator.apache.org/harmony/subcomponents/classlibrary/agreements.html
> 
> [2]
> http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/incubator-harmony-dev/200603.mbox/%3cfcb9f9160603240835i792de7dobabfc43a44e7c752@mail.gmail.com%3e
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 2006/7/19, Tim Ellison <t.p.ellison@gmail.com>:
>> Mikhail Loenko wrote:
>> > I think all that means that we will accept patches that fix the
>> messages
>> > and
>> > toStrings
>>
>> Sure, if people want to spend their time doing that then of course we
>> will be grateful.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Tim
>>
>>
>> > 2006/7/17, Geir Magnusson Jr <geir@pobox.com>:
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Alexey Petrenko wrote:
>> >> > I do not think that we really need to rewrite all the toString
>> >> messages.
>> >> > I suggest to update them as needed. For example if somebody will
>> >> > discover that some important application depends on it...
>> >>
>> >> The problem with that approach is that you are letting your users find
>> >> problems that you actually know are there.
>> >>
>> >> As I said in another note, I don't think we should drop everything
>> to do
>> >> this, but we *should* agree to do it lazily, track what has been
>> fixed,
>> >> and offer it as something that new people who want to get engaged
>> in the
>> >> project can do as well.
>> >>
>> >> geir
>> >>
>> >> >
>> >> > SY, Alexey
>> >> >
>> >> > 2006/7/17, Richard Liang <richard.liangyx@gmail.com>:
>> >> >> Good news! So we can output the same message if possible. Not sure
>> >> >> whether we need to update all of us toStrings? Any comments?
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Geir Magnusson Jr wrote:
>> >> >> > Sun, via Graham Hamilton (my favorite Sun Fellow), has stated
the
>> >> >> > following :
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >    Sun has no objections to Harmony (or other TCK-compliant
>> Java SE
>> >> >> >    implementations) using the same exception messages and
>> toString
>> >> >> >    formats as the Sun implementation of Java SE.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > Further, as a personal comment, he added :
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >     Keep in mind that since these messages and formats are
not
>> >> part of
>> >> >> >     the Java SE specifications, Sun may occasionally change
the
>> >> >> messages
>> >> >> >     and formats it uses.  We tend to be cautious in doing
that,
>> >> so as
>> >> >> >     not to impact applications, but it isn't ruled out.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > Also, it should be noted that in the APIs where Doug Lea or
Josh
>> >> Bloch
>> >> >> > had a major influence, there's a good change that the toString()
>> >> format
>> >> >> > *is* defined in the spec.  For example, see HashMap (via
>> >> AbstractMap).
>> >> >> > The point is that while it hasn't been done consistently
>> >> throughout the
>> >> >> > entire API, it's well understood by some that people depend
on
>> these
>> >> >> > things, and one should be careful about changing them.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > geir
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
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>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >>
>> >> >> --
>> >> >> Richard Liang
>> >> >> China Software Development Lab, IBM
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
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>> >> >>
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >>
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>> >>
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>> >
>>
>> -- 
>>
>> Tim Ellison (t.p.ellison@gmail.com)
>> IBM Java technology centre, UK.
>>
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>>
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