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From Ben Laurie <...@algroup.co.uk>
Subject Re: Against using Java to implement Java (Was: Java)
Date Fri, 13 May 2005 11:00:15 GMT
Matthew French wrote:
> Ben Laurie said:
> 
>>Mark Brooks wrote:
>>
>>>>I hope you use C to write the VM for Harmony.
>>
>>I've tried to sell C++ in the ASF many times. Even back when it wasn't
>>quite so bloated as it is now it wasn't a popular idea. Far fewer people
>>can write C++ than C, and hardly any of those can write _good_ C++.
>>
>>So, I think we'll end up back at C.
> 
> 
> As much as I like C++, I would have to agree that C should be the default.
> 
> But I am still thinking that we can make it so that we have a choice of
> multiple VM's - which can be written in C, C++, Java, .Net, Perl, Python
> or whatever other language takes the authors fancy. I can see many valid
> reasons why we would want to do this, but the trick is getting it to work
> without adding enormous complexity.
> 
> 
>>As I've said before, I'd like to see
>>a framework that _allows_ most of the VM to be run in Java (or Python,
>>or Perl, or Erlang, or whatever-floats-your-boat), but doesn't require it.
> 
> The bulk of a Java environment is the API/libraries. I would like to see
> the  libraries written in Java as much as possible. For example, LDAP
> functionality can be written entirely in Java. You just need to talk the
> right binary language.

I'm not arguing with that, I'm talking about the VM, not the libraries.

> Same applies to parts of the maths API like BigDecimal, date functionality
> (except some cases like getting the system date), XML classes, the bulk of
> the IO classes, etc. We should rely on the VM to optimise the Java code -
> I see no reason why an efficient VM cannot match C code or assembler in
> most cases.
> 
> There are exceptions: for example, advanced maths like sin() or a bulk
> block copy will perform much better using hardware. Even then, I think it
> could be useful to have implementations of these functions written in
> Java, and the ability to override them.

BigDecimal is an exception, too, if you want to do serious crypto. So is 
all the rest of the crypto.

Cheers,

Ben.

-- 
http://www.apache-ssl.org/ben.html       http://www.thebunker.net/

"There is no limit to what a man can do or how far he can go if he
doesn't mind who gets the credit." - Robert Woodruff

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