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Subject: Re: [DISCUSS] Spin out MR,
 HDFS and YARN as their own TLPs and disband Hadoop umbrella project
From: Eric Baldeschwieler <eric14@hortonworks.com>
In-Reply-To: <0CFE047B-8081-439C-880F-0515EE9382C4@jpl.nasa.gov>
Date: Fri, 31 Aug 2012 17:23:30 -0700
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To: general@hadoop.apache.org

Hi Folks,

Lots of good points raised here.  I remain convinced that the time to =
split Hadoop into TLPs in here, but I think we should also consider the =
practical concerns raised.

Hadoop 2.0 has been years of work in the making and is finally =
relatively close.  I think it would be a mistake to throw another =
impediment in the way of getting a stable version of 2.0 done, as many =
folks have pointed out.  So I'd suggest that we plan to do a split once =
there is a broad consensus that 2.0 is stable and widely deployed.

Perhaps folks interested in planning a split or concerned that a split =
might impact them can meet to refine a proposal that we can all consider =
implementing once 2.0 is stable.

What do folks think?

Thanks,

E14

On Aug 31, 2012, at 9:08 AM, Mattmann, Chris A (388J) wrote:

> Hey Doug,
>=20
> On Aug 31, 2012, at 9:00 AM, Doug Cutting wrote:
>=20
>> On Fri, Aug 31, 2012 at 8:09 AM, Mattmann, Chris A (388J)
>> <chris.a.mattmann@jpl.nasa.gov> wrote:
>>> I am saying that the current members of the Apache Software =
Foundation's Hadoop
>>> Project Management Committee exhibit the characteristics (not just =
during
>>> discrete events; it's been happening for a long time) of folks who =
in reality
>>> shouldn't belong to the same project management committee. Note: =
this is
>>> NOT a bad thing. There are probably plenty of (sub-)sets of groups =
at Apache
>>> and elsewhere that folks wouldn't fit in to. I've enumerated some of
>>> those characteristics that you can see sometimes spill over
>>> (meta thought discussions about moving things around; or drawing =
arbitrary
>>> lines around pieces of code that really have nothing to do with =
technical
>>> stuff, and more to do about insulating and control;),
>>=20
>> Hadoop's community is not perfect.  But the divisions in the =
community
>> are not primarily aligned with subcomponent boundaries.  A project
>> split will thus not likely fix the majority of these community
>> imperfections.  It may fix some, but ought to be pursued carefully so
>> that it doesn't cause more harm than good.
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> My own personal opinion of this is that yeah they aren't necessarily
> aligned subcomponent boundaries too so +1 agree with you.
>=20
>>=20
>>> but there are also other
>>> concerns such as frameworks put in to place (exclusivity amongst =
others)
>>> that themselves are pretty high indicators that this is an umbrella =
project.
>>=20
>> The partitioning of committers has now been removed in a separate
>> vote.  Hadoop is not a classic umbrella project.
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> Despite me thinking that's a band-aid it's probably at least a good =
start.
> Let's hope it leads to some better interactions amongst the community
> members and to better health overall.
>=20
> Cheers,
> Chris
>=20
> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
> Chris Mattmann, Ph.D.
> Senior Computer Scientist
> NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory Pasadena, CA 91109 USA
> Office: 171-266B, Mailstop: 171-246
> Email: chris.a.mattmann@nasa.gov
> WWW:   http://sunset.usc.edu/~mattmann/
> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
> Adjunct Assistant Professor, Computer Science Department
> University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA 90089 USA
> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>=20