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From Arun C Murthy <...@hortonworks.com>
Subject Re: [DISCUSS] Apache Hadoop 1.0?
Date Thu, 17 Nov 2011 00:03:22 GMT
How about this?

I have a vote running for 1.x at this point. We seem to agree about major/minor/patch version
and need for compatibility.

Beyond that, all other releases (at this point), whether it's 0.22 (unreleased) or 0.23 (very
alpha) are not worth debating endlessly.

Should we just revisit the versioning discussion when we are ready to release them and/or
support them?

I'm happy to continue using 0.23.x for now - I'd rather spend time on fixing 0.23.x than debating
now. 

To me this seems like a very Apache thing to do, what matters is the code and the community
- debates on versioning can come later when the bits are ready. No amount of labelling will
either produce or stabilize the software.

Thoughts?

Arun

On Nov 16, 2011, at 1:11 PM, Matt Foley wrote:

> I support giving all three active code branches a clean start, on an equal
> footing:
> 
> - The next release of 0.20-security (formerly expected as "0.20.205.1") to
> be 1.0.0, establishing branch-1.0
> - The next release of 0.22 to be 2.0.0, establishing branch-2.0
> - The recent release of 0.23.0 to be 3.0.0, establishing branch-3.0,
>    from which the formerly expected "0.23.1" may be released as 3.0.1
> - All three code branches to obey the established major.minor.patch
> versioning rules going forward.
> - So the next release from trunk to be 3.1.0 or 4.0.0, at the choice of the
> then release manager, and the pleasure of the community.
> 
> Regards,
> --Matt
> 
> On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 11:57 AM, Doug Cutting <cutting@apache.org> wrote:
> 
>> On 11/16/2011 10:15 AM, Scott Carey wrote:
>>> IMO what is important from the development and maintenance perspective is
>>> the _meaning_ of the
>>> major.minor.patch numbers as described in my previous message.
>>> 
>>> If a minor version number bump means that it is a superset of the
>> previous
>>> release and is backwards compatible, then that requirement on its own
>>> answers whether 0.22 can become 1.1, or if it must be a 2.0 release.
>>> 
>>> Whether hadoop starts using a new meaning for major.minor.patch is what
>> is
>>> of interest to me; starting at 1.x.y or 20.x.y or 999.x.y is marketing.
>> 
>> Scott, this is a great point.  Thanks for making it.
>> 
>>> The version number is completely meaningless on its own, pure marketing.
>>> However, if the numbers gain meaning through a clear definition of what
>>> the major.minor.patch numbers signify, then there is meaning and
>> structure
>>> going forward.
>>> The current state of affairs seems to be:
>>> major:  always 0
>>> minor:  potentially big changes; almost always breaks wire compatibility;
>>> occasionally breaks API backwards compatibility
>>> minor:  typically bug fixes only; 'bug fix' not well defined; almost
>> never
>>> breaks API or wire compatibility
>> 
>> Long ago I proposed such rules for Hadoop releases at:
>> 
>> http://wiki.apache.org/hadoop/Roadmap
>> 
>> These state that pre-1.0 releases behave roughly as above.
>> 
>>> I think the community can decide two things independently:
>>> 
>>> - Should 0.20.20x be renamed 1.0.y ?  (perhaps not, perhaps 0.23 should
>> be
>>> 1.0 and the others left alone).
>>> - Should hadoop adopt a new clear definition of major.minor.patch number
>>> significance?
>> 
>> Would you care to call a vote on one or both of these?
>> 
>>> example proposal:
>>> * major version number increment: signifies breaks in API backwards
>>> compatibility and/or major architecture overhauls.
>>> * minor version number increment: signifies possible API changes, but
>>> maintains API backwards compatibility.  Wire compatibility may break (see
>>> release notes).  Included functionality is a superset of previous minor
>>> release.
>>> * patch version number increment: signifies a release where all
>>> improvements are fully backwards compatible with the previous patch
>>> version, including wire format.
>> 
>> This is also similar to what the Roadmap wiki page indicates for
>> post-1.0 releases.
>> 
>> Renaming things after the fact to try to make them consistent when the
>> prior rules weren't consistently followed is not easy.  Instead we might
>> better focus on rules that we intend to obey for releases going forward
>> and then obey them.
>> 
>>> Whatever the meaning of the numbers turns out to be will dictate whether
>>> releases after a 1.0.x need to be 2.0.x or can be 1.1.x
>> 
>> Good point.  The most accurate approach would probably be to call each
>> existing branch a distinct major release.  Dropping the leading zero
>> would reduce confusion and avoid marketing but would still combine
>> 0.20.x and 0.20.20x which perhaps ought to be considered separate major
>> releases.  For me this is however a reasonable tradeoff since we're
>> better off focusing on improving things in the future than arguing about
>> marketing and how to hide our past versioning mistakes.
>> 
>> Doug
>> 


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