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From Cédric Champeau <cedric.champ...@gmail.com>
Subject Re: Binary compatibility fixed + Kotlin DSL
Date Wed, 20 Mar 2019 21:41:15 GMT
Well I think I disagree with most of what you just said. And Gradle Inc
will not deprecate the groovy support anytime soon. I'm well placed to know
it's not even in discussion. The only thing that I see could lead to such a
decision would be that groovy doesn't run on future versions of the JVM.
Let's not take decisions on speculations, but facts.

Le mer. 20 mars 2019 à 22:35, Sergio del Amo Caballero <
sergio.delamo@softamo.com> a écrit :

> I don’t know what do you imply that I am trying to hide.
>
> I think:
>
> - Gradle Groovy DSL helps Groovy adoption and thus survival.
>
> same as Geb DSL on top of Selenium helps Groovy adoption and thus
> survival.
>
> I think if everyone moves to Kotlin DSL, Gradle Inc will lose interest in
> maintaining Groovy Gradle DSL and eventually deprecate the Groovy Gradle
> DSL and remove it and hurt Groovy adoption and thus survival .
>
> I think that Apache Groovy build transitions towards Kotlin DSL is a
> signal towards prompting that move.
>
>  About maintaining the build itself:
>
> - If the only person touching the build is going to be someone with Kotlin
> and Groovy knowledge, then I would say better to have the DSL in the
> language they are more productive with it.
> - If persons, who touch the build, don’t know Kotlin, I think that it is
> another barrier. I assume that someone with no Kotlin Knowledge but using
> the Kotlin DSL and assisted by the IDE support is going to do a worst job
> than someone with a lot of Groovy knowledge using the Groovy Gradle DSL.
>
> Sergio del Amo
>
> On 20 Mar 2019, at 21:50, Cédric Champeau <cedric.champeau@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> And do you honestly think that trying to hide that by not using the Kotlin
> DSL would change anything?
>
> Le mer. 20 mars 2019 à 21:45, Sergio Del Amo <sergio.delamo@softamo.com>
> a écrit :
>
>>
>> I do in fact see this as at least a minor threat.  If Groovy itself can't
>> even manage to use the Gradle Groovy DSL, what hope remains for the
>> survival of the Groovy DSL?
>>
>>
>> Agree. I see a threat at least to Gradle Groovy DSL survival and probably
>> to Groovy in general. One may reason: If the Groovy programming language
>> build, which is manipulated by the people with more Groovy knowledge in the
>> planet, moved to Kotlin DSL, why should anyone else keep using the Gradle
>> Groovy DSL.
>>
>> Sergio
>>
>> On 20 Mar 2019, at 16:00, Milles, Eric (TR Tech, Content & Ops) <
>> eric.milles@thomsonreuters.com> wrote:
>>
>> I tried to get some info from Gradle on adding Eclipse DSLD for Gradle
>> and they scoffed at me.  They said it was a multi-person, multi-year effort
>> so why even try.  I was able to get some very basic support without that
>> much effort.  It could be moved forward and probably ported to IntelliJ as
>> well if there was some interest and support.
>>
>>
>> With regards to the change to the Groovy build script.  I'm not sure
>> newcomers are diving into the build scripts and making edits there.
>> My intuition is that they are running "./gradlew build" or whatever the
>> command is.  As long as the scripts run successfully, I'd posit a newcomer
>> is quite happy.
>>
>>
>> I do in fact see this as at least a minor threat.  If Groovy itself can't
>> even manage to use the Gradle Groovy DSL, what hope remains for the
>> survival of the Groovy DSL?
>>
>>

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