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From MG <>
Subject Re: Binary compatibility fixed + Kotlin DSL
Date Sat, 23 Mar 2019 20:00:24 GMT

On 22/03/2019 03:37, Thibault Kruse wrote:
> On Thu, Mar 21, 2019 at 11:03 AM MG <> wrote:
>> Maybe I am missing something, but it seems to me that Jetbrains could have put their
weight behind Groovy, especially its static part, gaining all the benefits with regards to
tool support / Intellisense they now claim for Kotlin
> I believe in this 2016 article Cedric had explained in good detail why
> this is not a mere matter of Jetbrains putting more weight behind
> anything:

I have read Cédric's post several times back then, and have reread it 
now, and to me it says exactly that: It would have been possible to do 
this in Groovy, just not by Cédric alone; e.g.:

"Does it make sense [to support Groovy in addition to Kotlin] ? Now that 
we made the decision to support Kotlin, that we proved it would provide 
the level of user friendliness we want and that it is statically 
compiled by default, does it make sense to put resources to support 
static Groovy in addition? I don’t have an answer to this. I thought 
yes, but now I’m not sure. Kotlin does the job. And honestly, they have 
great engineers working on the language."

In addition it has been confirmed here by other Groovy stalwarts that 
Gradle wanted changes in (the static part of) Groovy, which the project 
just could not deliver with the manpower available. Jetbrains had a 
choice, and they decided to go along the Kotlin route, and they offered 
that plus excellent IDE support to the Gradle people, who took it. As I 
have said before: Commercially all completely understandable - but at 
the same time it put them in direct competition with Groovy, with the 
fact that IntelliJ is the IDE for Groovy development making matters 
infinitely more complicated.

I know we are all upset by Cédric taking this step, but it has evidently 
been on his mind the last years, as can be seen in the same post from 
2016 (and imho multiple posts on this mailing list):

"This leads me to what I should do. And there, I’m a bit lost, to be 
honest. I work for a company that embraced Groovy, that is now embracing 
Kotlin. I love my job, I love working with Gradle, I love Groovy, and I 
quite enjoy Kotlin. I’m a passionate developer. I just want to continue 
having fun. But if you think that as such, I’m not a good representative 
of the Groovy community anymore, maybe I should step off from the Groovy 


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