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From Edward Capriolo <edlinuxg...@gmail.com>
Subject Re: [DISCUSS] Leave apache and the incubator
Date Thu, 05 Jul 2018 17:54:10 GMT
I did not want to leave apache either because of the huge swaths of time
invested into their build eco-system. That being said hosting the project
elsewhere will have only upsides.

For example, I host many projects using sonatype for project hosting.
https://central.sonatype.org/pages/ossrh-guide.html

With sonatype I can release with 3 commands. For apache I have to run 14
commands and then have a vote on this mailing list, a vote on another
mailing list, then manually push artifacts to apache SVN, and then send out
another [ANN] email proclaiming about how great the release is!

All this just takes unnecessary time. It is not fun, and if you are moving
jobs and I get fired for example and the report is not done the incubator
crew is unhappy. No one wants to do the monthly reports including myself so
that is that really.


On Thu, Jul 5, 2018 at 1:00 PM, chandresh pancholi <
chandreshpancholi007@gmail.com> wrote:

> Before moving it to GitHub, I would say let's give a chance.
> I am moving out from current job and I have plenty of time to contribute
> and promote gossip to forum in india.
>
> Happy to know your thoughts.
> -1 from me.
>
> On Thu, Jul 5, 2018, 10:21 PM Josh Elser <elserj@apache.org> wrote:
>
> > Hey Ed,
> >
> > I think taking Gossip back to Github is the right decision. The
> > Incubator is designed to support, long-running, low-activity projects
> > like you outline. The regular reports on progress become a time-sink
> > because there isn't the expected level of volume or participants.
> >
> > The incubator works well when there is an established community of folks
> > who are active. Like you say, this otherwise becomes a burden on you
> > (the sole contributor, best as I can see), taking your time away from
> > actually producing software.
> >
> > +1 from me
> >
> > On 7/5/18 9:18 AM, Edward Capriolo wrote:
> > > All,
> > >
> > > It was a sizable effort moving everything Gossip into the incubator.
> > Thank
> > > you all for your help along the way. Recently activity has slowed down,
> > > much of this falls on me.
> > >
> > > My opinion is gossip would be much better off moving back to github and
> > be
> > > independently hosted (by me or someone else) I believe for the
> following
> > > reasons:
> > >
> > > Infrastructure:
> > >
> > > AAA
> > > I forgot my password and when I clicked the "FORGOT MY PASSWORD" link I
> > got
> > > back a PGP email. No instructions in the email, lol city. I had to
> google
> > > around ASFs site to try to figure out what to do. Try googling 'pgp
> lost
> > > password' on apache's docs and figuring out what you need to do.
> > >
> > > Releases:
> > > The release process for most Java projects using maven 'mvn
> release:clean
> > > && mvn release:prepare && mvn release:perform". Hosting is
free and
> sign
> > up
> > > takes less then a day. Apache incubator wants to see releases as a sign
> > of
> > > health, yet the release process is involved. We have to do the maven
> > steps,
> > > generate an email with the checksums of all critical files, post a vote
> > on
> > > the incubator list, release the artifacts to central, and copy them to
> an
> > > svn directory.
> > >
> > > That is a vote across 2 mailing lists. and all the maven steps, and
> other
> > > manual steps, and that does not even count getting the website changed.
> > For
> > > me what is a 5 minute thing turns into a days long process. The net
> > result
> > > is we have features in trunk not in the release because doing a release
> > is
> > > just a drag. No one is even half interested in taking on this process
> > and I
> > > only did it because it is the only way.
> > >
> > > Community:
> > > Apache incubator is about building communities.
> > > Mailing list
> > > The mailing list is fairly opaque to me. I am sure there is some way to
> > > figure out what the subscriber base is but I don't know it.
> > >
> > > Jira
> > > Jira is great tool but the implementation slows people down. New users
> > have
> > > to sign up, and they are unable to assign themselves tickets until I
> > > navigate into JIRA and add them to a group. With open source and
> > attracting
> > > contributors it helps to be able to strike while the iron is hot.
> Having
> > > users confused as to weather they can start on a task does not help
> with
> > > that.
> > >
> > > GIT
> > > Apache has git but not github is only a mirror. When I have to merge
> > > peoples stuff I have to do it by hand with git commands. (No squash and
> > > merge button)
> > >
> > > Updating the site:
> > > Another series of obscure svn commands, making simple things hard,
> (much
> > > like the release process)
> > >
> > > Reports
> > > I get an 4-5 emails at different rates titled "Incubator Report Due" at
> > > different rates. Only one of them is for this project. We were never
> > great
> > > with reports. Almost all the info in the report could be automatically
> > > generated. We missed a report, we got placed onto a report now do every
> > > month category.
> > >
> > > The last one was due yesterday, sorry I was enjoying a hotdog at a
> bbq, I
> > > went to fill it out today and, saw yet another email chain on the
> > incubator
> > > list about how Gossip should leave apache. The report is just another
> > huge
> > > time suck, the time I spend doing it I could be doing an hour of code
> > > review.
> > >
> > > Even though some things are in the incubator 7 years, and some apache
> > TLPs
> > > have no activity Gossip out of the incubator seems to be a constant
> thing
> > > for some....
> > >
> > > So lets get out of here.
> > >
> >
>

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