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From David Jencks <>
Subject Re: geronimo plan help
Date Mon, 21 May 2007 16:25:30 GMT
Can the eclipse plan editors be based on jsr-88 DConfigBeans?  We  
certainly don't have complete DConfigBean support for our plans, but  
having an actual editor using them might provide some incentive to  
keep the jsr-88 support up to date and complete.  The more up to date  
parts of the deployment wizards in the admin console use DConfigBeans.

I think there's supposed to be some kind of generic dconfigbean based  
plan editor in NetBeans, but I've never tried it.

david jencks

On May 21, 2007, at 6:04 AM, Sachin Patel wrote:

> The primary issue is based on past experiences I chose EMF as the  
> modeling framework around the plans, but after several releases  
> came to the quick realization that it was too heavyweight for our  
> purpose.  This and the fact that are schemas each release have not  
> been cumulative additions and this makes it painful to provide UI  
> support for every version of the schema.  Thus I've unfortunately  
> considered this a dying effort.  What I would like to eventually do  
> is simplify at least the use of EMF and just use the XMLBeans  
> generated code and generate the editors out of it.  There is a good  
> bit of migration work to do this, but in the long wrong it would  
> simplify this greatly as well as reduce some footprint.
> The other option and one I like much better, is something we can do  
> in addition but prior to rebuilding the editors is  to extend the  
> XML structured text editor in WTP to build a custom deployment plan  
> editor for eclipse that provides full dynamic content assist into  
> our plans.  So though this won't provide a UI, it will provide a  
> reliable XML editor that will correctly display element choices as  
> you write your plans.  I think this would be much more valuable  
> since it would provide 100% coverage and thus more used than the  
> above and the maintainability would be a whole lot easier than  
> maintaining a full set of form editors.
> -sachin
> On May 21, 2007, at 7:47 AM, Shiva Kumar H R wrote:
>> Please read Aaron's book on Geronimo http:// 
>> page.html . I find it to be a great documentation for almost  
>> anything related to Geronimo Deployment Plans.
>> I can understand your frustrations. It's no different for me when  
>> it comes to manually creating Geronimo Deployment Plans.
>> I have always wished that Geronimo Development Tools (like  
>> Geronimo Eclipse Plug-in) provide some facility for auto-creating/ 
>> updating those deployment plans. I have created a wiki page  
>> summarizing my proposal: 
>> geronimo-deployment-plans-how-to-simplify-creation-or-updation.html
>> Would be useful if you and other users/developers can provide  
>> feedback on it as well post new proposals if any on that page. I  
>> think it would be useful if I float a separate mail on User list  
>> for this.
>> - Shiva
>> On 5/19/07, Doug Lochart <> wrote: Lin,
>> Thanks for trying to help.  I do appreciate it.  I may not have  
>> made my
>> questions/gripes clear.  So I will reiterate after your replies.
>> Lin Sun wrote:
>> > Hi, I am not a plan expert at all but I'll try answer your  
>> questions...
>> >
>> > What I find most useful besides reading the existing samples and
>> > documentations, is to use the schema files (generally located at  
>> the
>> > server_home\schema directory.)  For example, I am looking at my
>> > geronimo 2.0 server now, and the geronimo-module-{version}.xsd  
>> is the
>> > schema for namespace
>> > "{version} ".  You  
>> 'll
>> > want to look at the geronimo-application-{version}.xsd for
>> > geronimo-application.xml file.
>> >
>> I have looked at the examples and what I have now is from them as  
>> well
>> as help from the forum.  What I am griping about is that even the
>> documents are syntactically described in the xsd they are not  
>> described
>> verbally as to what they mean or how they are used.  I can read  
>> and use
>> a schema but it doesn't help if I don;t know how or why I am
>> constructing the xml document.
>> The other issue I had was that I have an EAR with a WAR and EJB-JAR
>> inside.  Nowhere in the documentation did it cover the rules of what
>> plans are required.  Almost all examples attacke either a WAR or EJB
>> alone.  The one example that starts doing an EAR is never completed.
>> So when I was creating mine I had a geronimo-application.xml (which I
>> kept outside the ear), a geronimo-web.xml in the WAR, and an
>> openejb-jar.xml in the ejb.jar.  One forum member asked me to  
>> remove the
>> geronimo-web.  It seemed to not break anything and I think it may  
>> have
>> made things go farther but again I still have no clue what  
>> combinations
>> (or why) of geronimo specific plans are required in an ear.
>> > Doug Lochart wrote:
>> >
>> >>
>> >> openejb-jar xmlns=" 
>> jar-2.1 ">
>> >>  <dep:environment
>> >> xmlns:dep="">
>> >>    <dep:moduleId>
>> >>      <dep:groupId>qdfrancepolicy.</dep:groupId>
>> >>      <dep:artifactId>FrancePolicyServverEjb</dep:artifactId>
>> >>      <dep:version>1.0</dep:version>
>> >>      <dep:type>car</dep:type>
>> >>    </dep:moduleId>
>> >>    <dep:dependencies>
>> >>      <dep:dependency>
>> >>        <dep:groupId>geronimo</dep:groupId>
>> >>        <dep:artifactId>tomcat</dep:artifactId>
>> >>        <dep:type>car</dep:type>
>> >>      </dep:dependency>
>> >>    </dep:dependencies>
>> >>    <dep:hidden-classes/>
>> >>    <dep:non-overridable-classes/>
>> >>  </dep:environment>
>> >>  <enterprise-beans>
>> >>    <session>
>> >>      <ejb-name>FrancePolicyServer</ejb-name>
>> >>      <jndi-name>qdfrancepolicy.FrancePolicyHome </jndi-name>
>> >>    </session>
>> >>  </enterprise-beans>
>> >> </openejb-jar>
>> >>
>> >> Is the dep:groupId supposed to match the sys:groupID on the  
>> app?  If
>> >> not how is it used?  What does artifactid do?  Does it matter  
>> what I
>> >> name it?  Does the name have to correspond to another field  
>> somewhere?
>> >
>> > No, it needs to be dep:groupId here as you had "<dep:environment
>> > > xmlns:dep="">"
>> > defined earlier.
>> >
>> This I got from an example but I still would like an explanation  
>> of what
>> it means.  To me it looks I just use the package of the bean as  
>> that is
>> what the example had (with a trailing dot) but no mention is made as
>> what, how or why.
>> > An artifactid is the artifact/module's unique id inside of the
>> > repository (typical location is server_home\repository).   You  
>> need to
>> > come up with a unique id for your module.   This is actually a  
>> maven
>> > concept.
>> >
>> Okay, this is what I thought so when I have an EAR with an EJB and  
>> WAR
>> what do I have?
>> 1 module (the application) with 2 or 3 artifiacts unique within the
>> module but not necessarily unique to all of the server OR
>> 3 moules one for the ear, war, and ejb and they need to be unique
>> globally?  Again this is the stuff that is missing a good  
>> narrative in
>> my opinion.
>> I would like to write up something covering all this stuff as I  
>> feel I
>> am not the only one in this boat.  However I cannot write about  
>> what I
>> do not grasp fully.
>> >> Then there is the dep:dependency.  I added geronimo/tomcat in  
>> because
>> >> I was asked to do so (thanks again by the way).  I assume it is
>> >> telling geronimo that I want to use tomcat as my web container but
>> >> again I can't find any decent explanation as to what is going on.
>> >> The IoC design of this thing is real cool but unless I am just
>> >> totally stupid ( I am green with EJB ) I cannot seem to find  
>> anything
>> >> that pieces things together in any coherent fashion.
>> >>
>> >> Am I missing something?  Did all of you pop in and look at the  
>> plan
>> >> docs and just suddenly realize how to do it in a day or something?
>> >
>> > By specifying the dependencies, your app asks the server to make  
>> sure
>> > all the dependency modules are avail when your app starts.
>> >
>> I _understand_ what a dependency means _BUT_ I could not find  
>> anything
>> that specified what modules you need, what are supplied as  
>> default, and
>> how you would know if you need them.  There are a lot of things in  
>> the
>> repository after you install geronimo.  It looks like all of  
>> geronimo is
>> a bunch of modules working together (great concept, I like the Spring
>> methodology) but to me as a newbie I think they are just part of
>> geronimo and that I do not need to mess with anything in there.
>> > HTH, Lin
>> >
>> Thanks Lin, I hope others can also jump in a get a good discussion
>> going.  Maybe I will get enough info and work my way through my  
>> problems
>> to actually write up a good overview.
>> Doug

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