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From Jean-Baptiste Onofré ...@nanthrax.net>
Subject Re: [Proposition] - Collaboration between Karaf - Geronimo
Date Thu, 15 Dec 2011 13:59:14 GMT
Hi Viola,

right, but together, by joining the effort from the two communities, I'm 
quite sure that we can provide something really great ;)

Regards
JB

On 12/15/2011 02:49 PM, viola lu wrote:
> But a lot of work to do
>
> On Thu, Dec 15, 2011 at 9:27 PM, viola lu <viola.lu@gmail.com
> <mailto:viola.lu@gmail.com>> wrote:
>
>     It seems like a good idea to me.
>
>
>     On Thu, Dec 15, 2011 at 5:57 PM, Jean-Baptiste Onofré
>     <jb@nanthrax.net <mailto:jb@nanthrax.net>> wrote:
>
>         Hi Charles,
>
>         as discussed on Karaf, I'm really eager to see the feedback from
>         the Geronimo community.
>
>         I would be more than happy to join and help the Geronimo
>         community around the Karaf usage and see what we can do to
>         provide a better Geronimo and Karaf.
>
>         Regards
>         JB
>
>
>         On 12/15/2011 10:55 AM, Charles Moulliard wrote:
>
>             Hi,
>
>             Within mailing list of Karaf, we have started a discussion
>             about the
>             idea to have a KarafEE release. This idea is similar to the
>             reflection
>             that OpenEJB team has had with TomEE but using Tomcat as Java
>             Application Server. As Geronimo uses Karaf as their kernel
>             (which is
>             not the case for Glassfish, JBoss, Eclipse Virgo, ...) that
>             makes a
>             lot of sense that we continue to promote karaf as platform
>             not only
>             for Integration Server like ServiceMix but also for J2EE
>             platform.
>             Since EJB3 spec and CDI, we see more and more projects
>             interested to
>             have/use an EJB container on Karaf and use it as an
>             alternative to
>             Spring (Dynamic Module/Blueprint). Developing a server,
>             certify it,
>             cost a lot.
>
>             As we we do not want to re-invent the wheel and due to number of
>             resources available, we prefer to capitalize on the
>             work/efforts done.
>             This is why we come to you to discuss the idea about
>             collaborating
>             together to improve existing geronimo-karaf platform to
>             address points
>             mentioned in this thread
>             (http://karaf.922171.n3.__nabble.com/Proposition-Apache-__KarafEE-td3585332.html
>             <http://karaf.922171.n3.nabble.com/Proposition-Apache-KarafEE-td3585332.html>)
>             to be able to provide a KarafEE or Geronimo distro but using
>             "features
>             mechanism" of Karaf to deploy OpenEJB, OpenJPA, new Karaf
>             web console,
>             ...
>
>             What do you think about that ?
>
>             Regards,
>
>             Charles Moulliard
>
>             Apache Committer
>
>             Blog : http://cmoulliard.blogspot.com
>             Twitter : http://twitter.com/cmoulliard
>             Linkedin : http://www.linkedin.com/in/__charlesmoulliard
>             <http://www.linkedin.com/in/charlesmoulliard>
>             Skype: cmoulliard
>
>
>
>
>             ---------- Forwarded message ----------
>             From: James Strachan<james@fusesource.com
>             <mailto:james@fusesource.com>>
>             Date: Thu, Dec 15, 2011 at 9:54 AM
>             Subject: Re: [Proposition] - Apache KarafEE
>             To: dev@karaf.apache.org <mailto:dev@karaf.apache.org>
>
>
>             Given Geronimo is already based on Karaf and focussed on EE;
>             am not
>             sure why re-implementing Geronimo inside Karaf is a good idea -
>             wouldn't it be better to just work with the Geronimo
>             community to fix
>             the issues you've raised (which seems to be about having more
>             Karaf-like approaches available inside Geronimo and fixing
>             up the web
>             consoles - neither seem that big a deal to me to require
>             forking a
>             community&  project?). Am sure the Geronimo folks would be
>             happy to
>
>             take contributions to enable more of Karaf's features in an
>             EE context
>             etc.
>
>             Certifying against EE is a massive amount of work; there has
>             to be a
>             really really good reason (and a ton of volunteers with a
>             massive
>             amount of free time who've got nothing better to do) to justify
>             duplicating that effort.
>
>             Given how modular OSGi&  Karaf are; am not sure why any of
>             these goals
>
>             can't be solved inside Geronimo (e.g. take Geronimo
>             uninstall its
>             console, install Karaf's console - no need to fork a
>             community for
>             that?).
>
>             On 14 December 2011 12:40, Charles
>             Moulliard<cmoulliard@gmail.com
>             <mailto:cmoulliard@gmail.com>__>  wrote:
>
>                 Hi,
>
>                 As you probably knows, I work with OpenEJB community
>                 since a couple of
>                 weeks to be able to deploy OpenEJB 4.0.0-SNAPSHOT on
>                 Apache Karaf. The
>                 OpenEJB container can already been deployed and EJBs
>                 jars registered.
>                 Work should be done around OpenEJB to be able to easily
>                 scan (like we
>                 do for deploy directory in Karaf) new or updated EJB
>                 jars file and add
>                 karaf command.
>
>                 When this new brick will be ready, everything will be in
>                 place to
>                 propose/provide an Apache KarafEE (EE = Enterprise
>                 Edition) release
>                 packaging OpenEJB, OpenJPA, Aries JPA, Aries JNDI, Pax
>                 Web, Aries
>                 Transaction Manager.
>
>                 The first question/remark that I will receive from the
>                 communauty will
>                 be : Great/Brillant idea but Apache Geronimo is already
>                 there and use
>                 Apache Karaf. So why developing a new server : There a
>                 lot of good
>                 reasons why we should do that and study my suggestion
>                 carefully but
>                 some arguments could be :
>                 (1) concurrence in this area is always good comparing to
>                 what we have
>                 in J2EE world, JBoss, TomEE, Glassfish. J2EE are de
>                 facto servers used
>                 in major and many Java projects. OSGI is not yet
>                 recognized as a
>                 robust and simple solution to be used due to lack of
>                 tooling,
>                 complexity to package and create bundles. So having a
>                 new OSGI true
>                 J2EE server could help to spread the world,
>                 (2) The packaging and deployment approach of Apache
>                 Geronimo is a bit
>                 different from Karaf and some of the Karaf features are
>                 not enable
>                 (e.g : features, ...).
>                 (3) The Geronimo web console cannot be reused for Apache
>                 Karaf and now
>                 with our new WebConsole we are independent of Apache
>                 WebConsole Felix
>                 (4) EJB is back since spec EJB3 like also JPA and more
>                 and more
>                 project does not longer use de facto Spring !
>                 (5) With Cellar/Fabric we have a strong foundation to
>                 deploy/manage/use Karaf in the cloud and design
>                 multi-servers
>                 architecture.
>
>                 KarafEE could be like Cellar, new WebConsole a
>                 subproject having its
>                 own assembly release process. It will contain assembly
>                 process,
>                 featurs, karaf commands, branding and web consoles stuffs.
>
>                 Remark : I have proposed also for OpenEJB that they have a
>                 karaf-assembly but our sub-project could be designed for
>                 that purpose
>                 -
>                 http://openejb.979440.n4.__nabble.com/Proposition-New-__maven-module-OpenEJB-Karaf-__tt4194577.html
>                 <http://openejb.979440.n4.nabble.com/Proposition-New-maven-module-OpenEJB-Karaf-tt4194577.html>
>
>                 What do you think about this proposition ?
>
>                 Regards,
>
>                 Charles Moulliard
>
>                 Apache Committer
>
>                 Blog : http://cmoulliard.blogspot.com
>                 Twitter : http://twitter.com/cmoulliard
>                 Linkedin : http://www.linkedin.com/in/__charlesmoulliard
>                 <http://www.linkedin.com/in/charlesmoulliard>
>                 Skype: cmoulliard
>
>
>
>
>             --
>             James
>             -------
>             FuseSource
>             Email: james@fusesource.com <mailto:james@fusesource.com>
>             Web: http://fusesource.com
>             Twitter: jstrachan, fusenews
>             Blog: http://macstrac.blogspot.com/
>
>             Open Source Integration and Messaging
>
>
>         --
>         Jean-Baptiste Onofré
>         jbonofre@apache.org <mailto:jbonofre@apache.org>
>         http://blog.nanthrax.net
>         Talend - http://www.talend.com
>
>
>
>
>     --
>     viola
>
>     Apache Geronimo
>
>
>
>
> --
> viola
>
> Apache Geronimo
>

-- 
Jean-Baptiste Onofré
jbonofre@apache.org
http://blog.nanthrax.net
Talend - http://www.talend.com

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