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From Ellen Tang <ltang.el...@gmail.com>
Subject Re: Wiki link to current version page
Date Thu, 12 Nov 2009 10:22:08 GMT
Hi,

It has been a long time. After some investigation, I think the way Quintin
suggested should work, but I wonder how we are gona get another domain for
the old docs? To my knowledge, we need to pay for domains, right? I am
definitely no expert on this.

However, as I am a technical writer dealing with documentation, I have an
idea about how to rearrange our document structure to add links of the
latest docs in the old docs without having to update all the links whenever
a new version is released. We can create a folder specially for the latest
documents and every time when a new version is released, we put the new docs
in that folder and move the docs of the last version out, so the links of
the latest documents is always the same. In this way, we only need to put
the links of the latest docs in the old docs once and do not need to keep
updating all the links when there is a new version.

For example, the latest version of G docs is 2.2, so the link of G 2.2 docs
would be:

http://cwiki.apache.org/DOC/index.html

The G 2.1 docs would be at http://cwiki.apache.org/GMOxDOC21/index.html.

And when we have G 3.0 docs, we move the G 2.2 docs to
http://cwiki.apache.org/GMOxDOC22/index.html, and put G 3.0 docs at
http://cwiki.apache.org/DOC/index.html, which is the same one for G 2.2 docs
when G 2.2 was the latest version.

However, this way only makes it much simpler if the names of most pages
don't change. If the names change, we still need to update the links. This
is what I learnt from the Confluence help website. I think it is a doable
way to let users easily find the latest documents.

Anyway, it's an idea, I need to know if it's possible to rearrange our
documents this way. If we can change the document structure and it does seem
necessary for the Geronimo documents, I will do some more investigation and
make it work.

I appreciate any comments from you.

Thanks!

Ellen

2009/10/16 Quintin Beukes <quintin@skywalk.co.za>

> I've also found that the search engines list very similar results for
> most searches (from my experience at least). So usually optimizing for
> Google ends up giving similar effects for all 3 major indexes
> (Yahoo/Live/Google).
>
> Beyond this, most other search engines just feed from one of these 3
> indexes. The other "real" indexes are mostly insignificant.
>
> Quintin Beukes
>
>
>
> On Fri, Oct 16, 2009 at 11:08 AM, Quintin Beukes <quintin@skywalk.co.za>
> wrote:
> > I definitely recommend looking into an archive if possible. You should
> > even be able to leave the documentation.html page's links the same,
> > only changing the old docs to be hosted on another domain. If at all
> > possible this would be a good solution to ensure the latest docs have
> > as much indexed on google as possible.
> >
> > Quintin Beukes
> >
> >
> >
> > On Fri, Oct 16, 2009 at 3:39 AM, Ellen Tang <ltang.ellen@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >> Hi Quintin,
> >>
> >> Thank you for your advice. That's very useful for us. I'll look into SEO
> and
> >> try to make our pages better.
> >>
> >> Best regards,
> >>
> >> Ellen
> >>
> >> 2009/10/14 Quintin Beukes <quintin@skywalk.co.za>
> >>>
> >>> Futher, if the old docs are taken out, it would leave a structure
> >>> that's much more focused on a the newest version, and thus reduce the
> >>> likeliness of GoogleBot seeing the pages as being too similar.
> >>> GoogleBot is very sensitive with this and sometimes sees 2 completely
> >>> irrelevant pages as being similar. I've found on 2 occasions that
> >>> changing the wording on one page could cause another page to suddenly
> >>> appear with the next index. This could be coincidence, as many reasons
> >>> could cause a page to become indexed, but the similarity seems most
> >>> probably since looking at the 2 pages you could understand how a bot
> >>> could see them as similar.
> >>>
> >>> Further, updating the documentation with basic SEO in mind, and
> >>> improving the link webs should help get more pages indexed - and
> >>> possibly even listed higher.
> >>>
> >>> Quintin Beukes
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Wed, Oct 14, 2009 at 5:19 PM, Quintin Beukes <quintin@skywalk.co.za
> >
> >>> wrote:
> >>> > The 2.2 docs are on google. In fact, all the versions are there. By
> >>> > default it only lists 1/2 similar pages, and the rest can be viewed
> by
> >>> > clicking on the "more results" link.
> >>> >
> >>> > From what I could see on the pages, the reason 1.1 docs are listed
> >>> > first is an SEO issue, in that the 1.1 docs contain the word Geronimo
> >>> > more, and has a ranked page linking to it. To host all the
> >>> > documentation online would make a for a major SEO task added onto the
> >>> > list. Maybe the best would be to add the old docs into an "archive"
> >>> > (another domain would be best), link into the archive, and have only
> >>> > the latest docs actually stored on the xwiki.apache.org domain. I
> >>> > don't know if this is possible, but it should definitely clear up the
> >>> > documentation issue.
> >>> >
> >>> > If you're unlucky the archive ends up ranking higher than the
> original
> >>> > and you're back to where you started, though I think that would be
> >>> > unlikely if there is a link trail to Geronimo from the xwiki root,
> and
> >>> > back up wards (and the same for all apps). This should keep the rank
> >>> > tree farely high, and an archive would be unlikely to overtake it.
> >>> >
> >>> > I'm no SEO expert, so this might not be the best advice, but it would
> >>> > be what I would have done.
> >>> >
> >>> > Quintin Beukes
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> > On Wed, Oct 14, 2009 at 5:02 AM, Ellen Tang <ltang.ellen@gmail.com>
> >>> > wrote:
> >>> >> Hi, I found that the "I'm feeling lucky" function only takes you
to
> the
> >>> >> first website listed in Google responding to your query. This is
why
> >>> >> you are
> >>> >> directed to 1.1 docs instead of 2.1. But I do see the problem that
> 2.2
> >>> >> docs
> >>> >> are not listed in Google.
> >>> >>
> >>> >> I've seen the Confluence help pages with the links of the latest
> >>> >> version as
> >>> >> you suggested. It works very well on the Confluence websites. I
> think
> >>> >> it's a
> >>> >> very good function but yet takes a lot effort to implement because
> we
> >>> >> have
> >>> >> so many pages and versions of G docs right now. Plus, once we have
a
> >>> >> new
> >>> >> release, all the links need to be updated. As discussed with Jeff,
> we
> >>> >> can
> >>> >> first try to make our latest docs display in Google.
> >>> >>
> >>> >> Please let us know if you have any suggestions for that. Thank
you!
> >>> >>
> >>> >> Best regards,
> >>> >> Ellen
> >>> >>
> >>> >> 2009/10/1 Juergen Weber <weberjn@gmail.com>
> >>> >>>
> >>> >>> Fixing the links doesn't seem to be the general solution,
> >>> >>> e.g. with
> >>> >>> geronimo ra.xml and "I'm feeling lucky" you get the 1.1 docs,
even
> if
> >>> >>> google
> >>> >>> knows the 2.1 docs.
> >>> >>> There should be a friendly big red box on old pages "There
exists a
> >>> >>> more
> >>> >>> recent version of this page" with a link to it.
> >>> >>>
> >>> >>> Greetings, Juergen
> >>> >>>
> >>> >>>
> >>> >>> Ellen Tang-2 wrote:
> >>> >>> >
> >>> >>> > I've tried to find the page of the same topic (Daytrader)
in
> >>> >>> > documentation
> >>> >>> > v2.1 by changing the link directly from
> >>> >>> > http://cwiki.apache.org/GMOxDOC20/daytrader.html to
> >>> >>> > http://cwiki.apache.org/GMOxDOC21/daytrader.html . The
page does
> >>> >>> > open
> >>> >>> > and
> >>> >>> > has correct contents, but when I tried to find the link
of the
> same
> >>> >>> > topic
> >>> >>> > in
> >>> >>> > the table of contents of v2.1 documentation (
> >>> >>> > http://cwiki.apache.org/GMOxDOC21/documentation.html ),
I
> couldn't
> >>> >>> > find
> >>> >>> > the
> >>> >>> > link for the "Daytrader" page, which does exist.
> >>> >>> >
> >>> >>> > I guess that this is why the google search can't find
the page of
> >>> >>> > "Daytrader" in Geronimo v2.1 documentation.
> >>> >>> >
> >>> >>> > Jeff, maybe you can have a check for this to see if you
get the
> same
> >>> >>> > result
> >>> >>> > as me.
> >>> >>> >
> >>> >>> > Thanks!
> >>> >>> >
> >>> >>> > Ellen
> >>> >>> >
> >>> >>> > 2009/9/30 chi runhua <chirunhua@gmail.com>
> >>> >>> >
> >>> >>> >> I think it's the problem of the template in auto-export
plugin,
> >>> >>> >>  but
> >>> >>> >> only
> >>> >>> >> confluence admin could do some configuration to update
the
> >>> >>> >> template.
> >>> >>> >>
> >>> >>> >> Jeff C
> >>> >>> >>
> >>> >>> >> On Wed, Sep 30, 2009 at 10:12 AM, Ellen Tang
> >>> >>> >> <ltang.ellen@gmail.com>wrote:
> >>> >>> >>
> >>> >>> >>> Hi Juergen,
> >>> >>> >>>
> >>> >>> >>> I guess that could be a good thing to do. We'll
discuss about
> that
> >>> >>> >>> to
> >>> >>> >>> see
> >>> >>> >>> if it's possible and necessary to do that.
> >>> >>> >>>
> >>> >>> >>> Thank you for your idea!
> >>> >>> >>>
> >>> >>> >>> Best regards,
> >>> >>> >>>
> >>> >>> >>> Ellen
> >>> >>> >>>
> >>> >>> >>> 2009/9/28 Juergen Weber <weberjn@gmail.com>
> >>> >>> >>>
> >>> >>> >>>
> >>> >>> >>>> Hi,
> >>> >>> >>>>
> >>> >>> >>>> googling often leads to an old version of
a Geronimo wiki
> page.
> >>> >>> >>>> e.g. google daytrader apache goes to
> >>> >>> >>>> http://cwiki.apache.org/GMOxDOC20/daytrader.html
> >>> >>> >>>>
> >>> >>> >>>> Can you somehow make the wiki automatically
display links to
> the
> >>> >>> >>>> most
> >>> >>> >>>> recent
> >>> >>> >>>> version?
> >>> >>> >>>>
> >>> >>> >>>> Thanks,
> >>> >>> >>>> Juergen
> >>> >>> >>>> --
> >>> >>> >>>> View this message in context:
> >>> >>> >>>>
> >>> >>> >>>>
> >>> >>> >>>>
> http://www.nabble.com/Wiki-link-to-current-version-page-tp25645167s134p25645167.html
> >>> >>> >>>> Sent from the Apache Geronimo - Dev mailing
list archive at
> >>> >>> >>>> Nabble.com.
> >>> >>> >>>>
> >>> >>> >>>>
> >>> >>> >>>
> >>> >>> >>
> >>> >>> >
> >>> >>> >
> >>> >>>
> >>> >>> --
> >>> >>> View this message in context:
> >>> >>>
> >>> >>>
> http://www.nabble.com/Wiki-link-to-current-version-page-tp25645167s134p25685083.html
> >>> >>> Sent from the Apache Geronimo - Dev mailing list archive at
> >>> >>> Nabble.com.
> >>> >>>
> >>> >>
> >>> >>
> >>> >
> >>
> >>
> >
>

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