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From "Jack Cai" <greensi...@gmail.com>
Subject Re: Geronimo VM-appliance?
Date Tue, 16 Dec 2008 04:54:00 GMT
If it's for developers, maybe add Maven too.

-Jack

2008/12/16 Donald Woods <dwoods@apache.org>

> OS+Java 6+FF3+Server+Samples+Eclipse+GEP would be ideal for developers....
>
>
> -Donald
>
>
>
> Jason Dillon wrote:
>
>> Any idea why kinda of images you'd like to see?  I'm gonna try and craft a
>> simple, base-os+Geronimo image to test out.  But I think we might want one
>> which has say roller configured perhaps even another which can demonstrate
>> AMQ's message distribution over a cluster.
>>
>> --jason
>>
>>
>> On Dec 15, 2008, at 3:24 PM, David Jencks wrote:
>>
>>  I think this is a great idea.  I doubt we can host it at apache.....
>>> unless we do something like bsd  + harmony (not even sure if that is likely
>>> to work)
>>>
>>> thanks
>>> david jencks
>>>
>>> On Dec 15, 2008, at 12:01 AM, Jason Dillon wrote:
>>>
>>>  I've been playing around with VMWare, trying to optimize my
>>>> virtualization configuration, and it occurred to me that folks who are savvy
>>>> to the virtualization concept might benefit from having a
>>>> linux+openjdk+geronimo appliance ready to "play with" perhaps another which
>>>> is "ready for enterprise configuration".
>>>>
>>>> From an Apache POV its another distribution, specific to a
>>>> virtualization tool, like VMWare, but users who already have the required
>>>> tools installed, can basically download + install + run, and they have a
>>>> functional environment...
>>>>
>>>> IMO this is really nice as it drops a ton of evil platform issues (er ya
>>>> *F*-windows) but also can resolve issues about which JDK did you install
and
>>>> did you configure your JAVA_HOME, blah, blah, blah.  There are a ton of
>>>> problems a newbie might run into when trying to play around with Geronimo
as
>>>> we all know.
>>>>
>>>> Granted, not everyone is going to have a virtualization environment
>>>> setup, but some will I'm sure... probably even the more savvy users I would
>>>> guess (and well we can probably give docs to explain how to setup some virt
>>>> stuff too if needed).  But those who do, we can deliver them highly
>>>> functionally images for "playing" or images tailored for enterprise
>>>> consumption.  That might be one which is bare-minimum for folks that need
a
>>>> starting point to roll uber-custom configurations (perhaps with a nice build
>>>> env setup already for them, primed with repo artifacts) or one for users
>>>> that want to deploy clustered ejb+web applications, and then another for
>>>> simple web apps.
>>>>
>>>> Seems to me that the advantage here is that you can configure the server
>>>> and provide simple admin+user documentation on a known quantity... that
>>>> being the VM which we publish for them.  That VM *should* perform
>>>> *approximately* the same on any non-virtual host configuration (assuming
we
>>>> craft the image correctly).  But, okay I'm no math genius, but from my
>>>> perspective... lets say 10x users have a problem due to config stuff right
>>>> now, maybe 1-2x might have a problem with the image (its damn easy to setup
>>>> a VM-configuration these days, and also damn easy to install an image).
>>>>
>>>> So, *assuming* that folks are savvy with VM-technology, it might very
>>>> well be *easier* to provide a VM image pre-configured for their
>>>> evaluation/exploration of Geronimo.
>>>>
>>>> I don't really expect folks to use that image for production, but I
>>>> would expect them to learn from then image to build their production
>>>> environment, perhaps even copying the configuration from the image as a
>>>> bootstrap (and I think we should provide docs on how to do that).  Though
>>>> for some folks, the image (say the simple webapp image) might work just
>>>> fine.
>>>>
>>>> I've seen a lot of mails about system dependent problems... windows
>>>> especially, damn I hate that platform... but there are other problems too.
>>>>  Like folks on Redhat who don't uninstall the crappy GNU java muck and
>>>> manually install the sun/ibm JDK, etc.  So I'm not just hating on windows
>>>> (though you and I both know I really, really, really... really hate it).
>>>>
>>>> * * *
>>>>
>>>> Bottom line is that I think use of virtual machines is becoming more
>>>> popular.  I think it would be beneficial to Geronimo if we provided one (or
>>>> more) virtual machines images to showcase Geronimo's full power... and
>>>> reduce the myriad of complications some initial users run into why running
>>>> locally on their own systems.  And furthermore, we can provide more
>>>> customized images which fully exploit the full power of the system, without
>>>> having to go and complicate our build (create new assemblies, slowing down
>>>> build/dev times, etc).
>>>>
>>>> After writing all this, I think the only real issue is, since we are
>>>> part of Apache and this would technically be considered  some sort of
>>>> *release* artifact... who does including Linux (whatever distro) jive with
>>>> the ASF legally?
>>>>
>>>> I believe its a good idea... obviously or I would not have wasted the
>>>> time to try and explain my thoughts to you.  But I'm unsure that the ASF
can
>>>> allow for such things, short of an ASF operating-system coming into
>>>> existence (which I'm neither counting on, nor hope happens).  Perhaps a
>>>> separate sourceforge or code.google project might suite better for legal
>>>> issues?
>>>>
>>>> Anyways, seems like a good idea, I'd like to see it happen, its not that
>>>> hard... what do you folks think?
>>>>
>>>> --jason
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>>

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