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From "Ted Kirby" <ted.ki...@gmail.com>
Subject Re: [DISCUSS] Remove GEP server features?
Date Mon, 11 Aug 2008 13:38:07 GMT
As I mentioned in the note, none of the packaged servers provide a
"download and install" function.  They appear to assume that the
server is already installed.

Ted

On Mon, Aug 11, 2008 at 9:33 AM, Lin Sun <linsun.unc@gmail.com> wrote:
> It would be great to have AG added to the list of server adapters
> bundled with WTP!  I wonder what is the behavior of other servers'
> adapters, such as Tomcat, WAS or JBoss... do they provide the
> "download the server" function?   If they do, users may expect us to
> work the same way.
>
> Lin
>
> On Sat, Aug 9, 2008 at 2:59 PM, Ted Kirby <ted.kirby@gmail.com> wrote:
>> One motivation here is to simplify things for users.  The first choice
>> when installing GEP using the eclipse update manager is do you want an
>> "Apache Geronimo Runtimes" or "Geronimo WTP Server Adapters".  (I
>> addressed a simplification issue in the "Geronimo WTP Server Adapters"
>> section in (GERONIMODEVTOOLS-469) Remove Core Geronimo Feature.)
>>
>> Here, we take aim at eliminating "Apache Geronimo Runtimes".
>>
>> Should we allow a user to download the server from eclipse?
>>
>> Do we want to use the eclipse update manager to distribute our
>> servers?  Certainly with plugins and configurable servers, this does
>> not seem to be the way to go going forward.
>>
>> The org.apache.geronimo.server.{jetty,tomcat}.v2{01}.feature features
>> allow the various instances of the server to be downloaded and
>> installed.
>>
>> There are two ways this can work.  First, one of these server features
>> may be installed in eclipse.  This results in the server.zip file
>> being downloaded from the eclipse update web site (which is much (3-4
>> times) slower than downloading the server.zip with your web browser),
>> and putting it the eclipse features directory.  When you define a
>> server, you choose an empty directory, and click the "Download and
>> Install" button.  The server .zip previously downloaded is then
>> expanded to this directory.  The second way this can work is to skip
>> the installation of server feature altogether, and simply define a new
>> server, choose an empty directory, and click the "Download and
>> Install" button.  The same server.zip file is downloaded to the
>> eclipse features directory, then expanded to the target directory.
>>
>> There are development costs and issues associated with maintaining and
>> continuing to provide this support.  Keeping the license and notice
>> files in-sync is one issue.  The "Download and Install" function has
>> consumed a large number of development hours.  There is a problem with
>> uninstalling them in Ganymede.  (See (GERONIMODEVTOOLS-467) Can't
>> uninstall runtime after installing it via eclipse update manager in
>> Ganymede for details.)  Also with Ganymede, there is a new version of
>> the eclipse update manager, p2.  It is supposed to be compatible with
>> the old one.  It handles the server adapters OK, but not the server
>> features.  It reverts to the older update manager to install them.  (I
>> think this is why they cannot be uninstalled.)
>>
>> I think most users will download the server, install it and run it,
>> and especially customize it.  Then, I think they will use eclipse and
>> GEP to develop applications for their existing server.  I don't think
>> many users are using eclipse to download the server.
>>
>> These servers have their WTP server adapters bundled with WTP:
>>
>> Apache Tomcat
>> IBM WAS v6.0
>> JBoss
>> ObjectWeb JOnAS
>> Oracle OC4J
>>
>> I think we should pursue getting GEP in that list.  When defining new
>> servers for these servers, only Apache Tomcat offers a "Download and
>> Install" button, and it is permanently grayed out.  Most of them
>> populate the app sever directory text box with /your_server_root/...,
>> indicating they expect you to install it outside of eclipse.
>>
>> I think we can hide the server features, but still allow "Download and
>> Install" to work.  I would put the server features on some other site,
>> not the main one.  Then, users would not see it as an install option,
>> but the "Download and Install" button would still work, because it
>> would find the server on this other web site.
>>
>> However, all things considered, maybe we should remove the server
>> features altogether.  We are so close to GEP 2.1.2 that we may want to
>> do this until after GEP 2.1.2.  For 2.1.2, we may want to hide the
>> server feature as described above.
>>
>> Comments?
>>
>> Ted Kirby
>>
>

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