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From David Jencks <>
Subject Re: sample applications
Date Thu, 12 Jun 2008 16:59:54 GMT

On Jun 12, 2008, at 9:33 AM, Hernan Cunico wrote:

> Hi All,
> I'm looking back into the sample apps (samples and docs) and I think  
> we are missing the point of the samples.
> We kinda had this discussion some time ago and I thought we were  
> going to go in a different way.
> The purpose of the sample applications was to demonstrate Geronimo  
> support/implementation of the different functionalities and  
> features. To provide some sort of transition path from any other app/ 
> platform to Geronimo. Start easy with the basic requirements,  
> understanding the Geronimo specific deployment plans, etc. and then  
> gradually involve the different G specific "goodies".
> If we require all users to understand and be familiar with Geronimo  
> plugins and maven so then they can get their hands on a sample  
> application for Geronimo; I think we are adding unnecessary barriers  
> for new users.
> In the past, we provided the samples source and in most cases the  
> binaries ready to install, all along as part of the full sample  
> documentation. Users were not required to use svn, plugins, or maven  
> if all they wanted to do was to get familiar with how to implement  
> JAX-WS in Geronimo for instance.
> Plugins are a way to distribute these applications, a convenience to  
> install the sample binaries once the samples get released. Plugins  
> should not be a requirement for sample applications, it should be an  
> option.
> what do others think?

I think some realism about our capabilities for maintaining the  
documentation is called for.  If the samples had been being kept up to  
date, working, adapted to latest geronimo, etc, I'd say you might have  
a point.  However they didn't work, the documentation was full of  
misleading statements and errors, and they didn't demonstrate best  
practices in geronimo.  One of my main goals working on the samples is  
to produce something simple and automated enough so we have some  
slight chance of keeping it up to date: even with the simplifications  
I've introduced I don't have a lot of hope for this.

When the samples are released, if we stick with the current setup  
based on plugins, we will be publishing the javaee application  
artifacts and the plugins.  The plans to deploy the artifacts  
independently are inside the plugins.  While this is not the most  
convenient location the plans will be available.

I also don't think that requiring users to build the sample projects  
with maven is unreasonable.  We certainly don't provide any other way  
of building the applications, and I don't see any reason or argument  
why we should.  If you build the apps you get the plans in <sample>- 
[jetty|tomcat]/target/resources/META-INF/plan.xml. I've tried to state  
this clearly in the top level samples documentation.

If you are suggesting including source and binary attachments in  
confluence I think that is a bad idea -- they will never get updated  
-- but could be considered after we release the samples.  We certainly  
can't do that before a release vote.

david jencks

> Cheers!
> Hernan

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