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From Matt Hogstrom <>
Subject Re: micro-G modules(configs)
Date Mon, 09 Oct 2006 11:12:23 GMT

On Oct 6, 2006, at 10:37 AM, Joe Bohn wrote:

> I couldn't quite decide what to call it either which is why I'm  
> using the term "geronimo-framework" for the assembly.  But I'm  
> certainly open to other opinions.   I don't envision this being  
> something that the casual user would pick up directly.  I image  
> that we would still ship the full j2ee assembly and possibly even  
> the minimal assembly.  Micro-G would be available for more  
> sophisticated users that wanted to build a custom image and for  
> vendors who might pick up Micro-G, build their own custom image,  
> and then add their own software for redistribution/sale.

Framework makes sense as I think that is where people wanted to go  
with Geronimo based on my recollection from many e-mails and  
conversations.  I'll pop in my 2c here given Joe's comments above.

What makes sense in my twisted mind is that Micro-G provides the core  
wiring framework to build a server (as joe indicated).  From that we  
install plugins to assemble a server.  The question then becomes how  
would a user consume this?  and perhaps we need to define the groups  
of users that Geronimo would appeal to.  Here is my quick hit list:

J2EE developers - these folks are interested in a server that they  
can use to develop and deploy J2EE applications.  They are not really  
concerned about the plumbing of the server but are more interested in  
consuming ready made things like Eclipse, Geronimo, etc. to build an  

Application Developer - May not want all the gizmos of J2EE / JEE but  
is definitely interested in things like Servlets and Spring.  They  
would like a server that is sized for their needs and includes the  
components they need for their applications to run.  People that use  
Tomcat + other stuff fall into this category.

System Developers - these folks are more in tune with the server and  
its various pieces.  They might be interested in the Geronimo Tx  
Manager or other piece parts of the server.  They are willing to  
write GBeans and other Geronimo specific artifacts to accomplish  
their goals.  They probably want the ability to create custom server  

ISV's - Pretty much the same as System Developers but might have  
targetted deployment environments like Kiosks or embedded devices.   
They want to build and distribute Applications and will use Geronimo  
as their core runtime infrastructure.  They are probably more  
interested in stability than innovation as their distributing  

There are probably lots more user types but I think the above covers  
the spectrum pretty broadly.  With that said, how do we meet their  

If I were in their shoes I would like to be able download either pre- 
built server configurations (J2EE certified) or build a custom  
assembly.  In order to allow both I wonder if it makes sense to  
introduce the concept of server templates.  Here is what I mean:

Since every assembly we make now is hand turned we could make the  
configuration simpler so a user could express their intended server  
configuration through an XML file and we provide a generic assembler  
that would read this template, resolve dependencies and spit out a  
binary server config that could be distributed (downloaded as a  
server).  The template would allow for command line building of the  
server such that a user would not need to interactively build it  
(GShell ?)

This means that there would be a distribution of Geronimo that  
included micro-G along with all the gorp we normally build.  The gorp  
would be in a repository format (like plugins or the same) so that a  
user could use templates to build a server without being network  
connected if they so chose).  So we would make the following  
available for distribution:

Geronimo J(2)EE certified (1.4 / 5.0, etc.) Tomcat / Jetty
Minimal Tomcat / Jetty
Micro-G (all components to build yur own custom server).

So in effect, the J(2)EE and Minimal servers would simply be  
templates that happen to build server assemblies.  Of these, the  
Geronimo team certifies the J2EE one.

Anyway, should I put these ideas on the cwiki for discussion /  
clarification?  It sounds that this is the general direction we're  
headed in and is rather unique.  If we agree in concept it would be  
good to get our web page updated to reflect these goals (vision) of  
the project so people can see where we're going and get involved if  
they're interested.


The thinking above is really a comglomeration of lots of discussion  
on the list.

Matt Hogstrom

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