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From Matt Hogstrom <>
Subject Re: Release Early, Release Often
Date Thu, 07 Sep 2006 19:53:42 GMT
How would you handle J2EE certification then?  I don't know the rules around it but I want
to be 
careful about confusing users.

I'm all for release early and often (tried to do that with 1.1.1 but these pesky security
issues and 
other problems pop up).  I think getting a weekly drop available will be a significant help.
tried that in the past (I think Blevins spearheaded new feature Wednesdays).

If we got that going first (and not considering releases) I think that would be a huge help.
happy to assist when 1.1.1 gets out the door.

Jason Dillon wrote:
> Something tells me that we are gonna end up with a 6mo+ release cycle 
> (with additional month just to make the release)... and that if we are 
> lucky.
> So far I'm not hearing anyone else signing the "Release Early, Release 
> Often" tune.
> I'd stop thinking about 1.2 as JEE5 or whatever thing that is gonna take 
> a bunch of time to do... and just get some incremental work done and 
> push out a release.
> --jason
> On Sep 7, 2006, at 7:22 AM, Matt Hogstrom wrote:
>> I think Dain said he was scouring the primordial soup of trunk to 
>> determine which level of life form would emerge.  At this point if its 
>> a single cell organism then a .2 release might seem inappropriate.  If 
>> its an intergalactic space traveler that can cure cancer, solve world 
>> peace and make a good pina colada then perhaps we should go to 3.0 :)
>> Dain, how are we doing with the data mining?  Seem like the natives 
>> are getting restless :-0
>> Dave Colasurdo wrote:
>>> Here is the wikipedia definition for Pre-Alpha, Alpha, Beta, etc..
>>> The definitions pretty much agree with my preconception of what an 
>>> Alpha  would contain.
>>> IMHO, trunk is not currently in an Alpha state and doesn't accurately 
>>> reflect the "majority of the software requirements" that will be 
>>> addressed in G1.2.
>>> It seems that trunk is currently in a pre-alpha state and I believe 
>>> making an occasional unstable/nightly build available would allow 
>>> users/developers to get familiar with the latest and greatest 
>>> functions in trunk without giving the false impression that G1.2 is 
>>> currently in Alpha state.
>>> Just my .02
>>> -Dave-
>>> Jason Dillon wrote:
>>>> I am thinking about an 1.2-alpha release, which does not need to 
>>>> pass any tck, but can still be downloaded by folks that want to test 
>>>> their apps on the bleeding edge (with out having to build).  While 
>>>> there is nothing major from a J2EE perspective in the alpha, a lot 
>>>> has changed, or will change very shortly.  Here is a list with 
>>>> comments of new and upcoming stuff:
>>>> ActiveMQ 4.1, is about to get committed.
>>>> Derby is about to get upgraded.
>>>> Log4j is about to get upgraded.
>>>> Use of concurrent util is about to get changed to 
>>>> backport-concurrent-util.
>>>> Lets not forget that we changed the build system, which mostly 
>>>> impacts development, but also has an impact on the configuration 
>>>> files, and plugins... new CAR m2 plugin.  I think it would be really 
>>>> good to get an alpha out so that people can easily test and provide 
>>>> feedback.
>>>> New m2 plugin to start/stop Geronimo, soon to have new deploy goals.
>>>> A bunch of bug fixes.
>>>>  * * *
>>>> I think that by releasing a 1.2-alpha, that we also start down the 
>>>> path of changing the perception of how quickly we release.  The 
>>>> alpha can also serve to help us get some experience using the m2 
>>>> release plugin so that when it comes time for a non-alpha/beta 
>>>> release that we have confidence in the procedure... and this will 
>>>> give us time to make sure that we have the right configurations and 
>>>> setup to make a release with relative ease.
>>>> Also, more of a side effect, by making a new release, it helps 
>>>> control the JIRA roadmap, right now 1.2 is filled with a bunch of 
>>>> build system related fluff and other bits...
>>>> I think that we have enough changes (or soon to change in the next 
>>>> days or so) to warrant an alpha.  I don't see any reason why not 
>>>> to... we don't need to spend days/weeks to ensure the TCK passes, 
>>>> because we don't need to run it.  It should be sufficient to vote on 
>>>> an alpha and then cut the release, which should be easy with the 
>>>> maven release plugin, and even easier with my gpg-sign'ing mojo to 
>>>> sign and upload all artifacts.
>>>> I believe that having this alpha out will benefit our community, 
>>>> showing that we are going to start releasing more often, give people 
>>>> a chance to provide feedback more often an earlier.
>>>> I certainly do not expect any production customers to use this, but 
>>>> I do expect that app developers will, so they can ready their apps 
>>>> for deployment on the platform.  We will clearly label this as an 
>>>> alpha release, and clear state that it has not been TCK certified.
>>>> I don't see any downside to cutting a release off of trunk soonish, 
>>>> in the next week or so.
>>>> --jason
>>>> On Sep 6, 2006, at 9:13 AM, Kevan Miller wrote:
>>>>> On Sep 5, 2006, at 4:40 PM, Dain Sundstrom wrote:
>>>>>> According to our STATUS file, our last feature release (1.1) was

>>>>>> on 2006-06-26 which is about 2.5 months ago.  I'm not sure exactly

>>>>>> what we have in trunk right now, but I'd guess we most likely have

>>>>>> enough to do a release right now.   I'm going to spend a few hours

>>>>>> today browsing the JIRAs and SVN logs and compile a list of the 
>>>>>> features we have in trunk right now. Anyways, I'll let you know 
>>>>>> what I find and we can figure out what we want to do.
>>>>> I'd be interested to hear more concretely what's in Geronimo trunk, 
>>>>> OpenEJB 2.2, etc that's not in 1.1.1...
>>>>> --kevan

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