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From Dain Sundstrom <d...@iq80.com>
Subject Re: GBeans representing separately persistent data
Date Mon, 12 Jun 2006 17:31:32 GMT
I think the problem here is the GBean framework is not flexible  
enough to support this.  The integrations of Tomcat, Spring,  
ServiceMix, and ActiveMQ have been extremely painful and have  
resulted in (no offense) very limited integrations.

The approach Aaron has laid out is in my mind the best given the  
current technology, but I'd rather not see us go down the path of  
adding more deployers.  The deployers are the major thing holding  
back integration of XBean (this is why I rearchitected OpenEJB  
deployment in dead-1.2).  Then again, if I were you, I don't think I  
would believe that a XBean integration is ever coming.

-dain

On Jun 11, 2006, at 5:34 PM, Aaron Mulder wrote:

> I looked at the developerworks article.  The GBean there is extremely
> simple.  It starts a Quartz scheduler, but has no code or methods to
> configure it or do anything with it.  I think it was more a
> demonstration of how to write a GBean than anything else.
>
> As for why I wanted to represent jobs as GBeans, it's so you can
> deploy and manage them.  That is, you can deploy a job, start it, stop
> it, or undeploy it, as well as managing its schedule, executing it
> immediately, querying the last time it ran and the next time it'll
> run, etc.  Since it's a unit that can be deployed and managed, it
> seemed logical to represent it as a GBean.
>
> I guess the alternative you're suggesting is to expose the scheduler
> as a GBean and if you want to do anything with jobs you have to
> interact with the scheduler GBean and call methods on it.  That would
> work, but I don't think it's as nice in practice.  For one thing, I'm
> not sure how you'd get the job classes to the scheduler -- it seems
> like you might need to alter the scheduler module to add more
> dependencies every time you added new jobs -- at least if you were
> using a database for job persistence.  Also, if you want to add a job,
> you need to write some kind of code to access the scheduler and add
> the job, which seems a little onerous.
>
> With the job-as-GBean approach, in contrast, you can pack your job
> classes in a JAR with a plan that defines the schedule, and deploy
> that using the normal Geronimo deployment tools.  Then in addition to
> convenient deployment, they each get their own class loader, and can
> declare dependencies on other application modules (e.g. to get the
> classes necessary to call a session bean).
>
> Thanks,
>    Aaron
>
> On 6/11/06, David Jencks <david_jencks@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>> On Jun 11, 2006, at 4:20 PM, Aaron Mulder wrote:
>>
>> > So I've been playing around with a Quartz integration plugin.  My
>> > first stab only supported an in-memory schedule, but Quartz also
>> > supports storing to a database.  Here's my issue with that.
>> >
>> > Right now I have a GBean representing a scheduled job.  When you  
>> start
>> > it, the job is scheduled.  When you stop it, the job is deleted.
>> > Therefore when you start the server, the scheduler is started  
>> and the
>> > deployed jobs are started, and I guess they're effectively  
>> persistent
>> > using config.xml as storage instead of using a DB.
>>
>> I've never used quartz but the idea of a job as a gbean seems odd to
>> me.  I would expect there would be one quartz gbean and everything
>> you scheduled would be saved in a database.  Can you provide a lot
>> more detail about what the job gbean is like?  So far I don't get it,
>> it seems like extreme impedance mismatch.
>>
>>
>> >
>> > So let's say we let you store the job info to a database.  What
>> > happens to the job GBeans?  You can take down the server, delete  
>> all
>> > your jobs from config.xml, add some new jobs to the database, and
>> > start the server again.  So the GBeans can get totally out of sync
>> > with the data they represent.
>> >
>> > I guess what would be most appropriate for this case would be some
>> > kind of "transient GBean" that does not save to config.xml.  So  
>> when
>> > the scheduler starts it could create GBeans representing all the  
>> jobs,
>> > which you could use to manage it, but changes to the GBeans  
>> would only
>> > affect the Quartz database (not config.xml) and when you shut down
>> > they'd all go away.  Until next time you start up, and the  
>> scheduler
>> > would recreate all the job GBeans again.  What do you think?
>>
>> I don't get why these are "gbeans".   I must be missing something
>> important here.
>> >
>> > The alternative is to keep using GBeans as persistence, and just  
>> add
>> > GBeans to represent calendars and triggers, which are the other two
>> > fundamental types in Quartz.  That certainly seems like the more
>> > expedient path for now.
>>
>> I also don't understand why these other types would be gbeans
>> either.  I'd really appreciate more detail on this.  This could well
>> be the best model, but I don't see why yet :-)
>>
>> BTW I thought jeff already did a quartz integration, in a
>> developerworks article, have you looked at what he did?
>>
>> thanks
>> david jencks
>>
>> >
>> > Thanks,
>> >     Aaron
>>
>>


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