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From Dain Sundstrom <>
Subject Re: Cannot build 1.1 on Windows - long file paths
Date Fri, 07 Apr 2006 17:29:18 GMT
Please stop blaming the m2 repo structure for this problem.  The m2  
repo structure only increased the path of our longest path by 36  
characters.  The true problem is that David and I moved the unpacked  
configurations into the repository.  We did this because of the  
chunkiness of the numbered directories in the config-store  
directory.  The m2 repository structure makes querying the repository  
for version numbers possible and it is this querying that makes  
optional version numbers possible.

I think we have two issues that both must be addressed:

1) The ears we generate in our build have very long internal paths,  
154 characters.  This is just bad form, and vastly reduces the user  
path head room.

2) We need to move the unpacked ears our of the repository and into a  
separate flat directory structure.

I can look at the second one later today after fixing the redeploy  
command.  Can someone take a look at getting our build to jar up the  
classes and compiled jsps in our build.  I'll fix the generated  
classes in our build.


On Apr 7, 2006, at 6:50 AM, Matt Hogstrom wrote:

> Thinking about this some more I believe we need to make a good  
> decision here as having to revisit this issue in the future will  
> cause users to have to change how the server works.  I've been  
> talking to a new user that has a larger server farm and is very  
> interested in the Geronimo server as their new foundation.   
> However, they run a few thousand servers and are VERY sensitive to  
> changes in the behaviour of the server in terms of how it impacts  
> them.  Changes to the repsoistory will affect their operational  
> experience dramatically and they do run Windows (go Bill Gates).   
> They are watching this thread with keen interest.  Their biggest  
> concern is changing how their build and distribution system works  
> and changes in this area is highly disruptive for them.
> My view of the problem is that there are really three distinct  
> areas of a path.  They are the user area, the server area and the  
> application area.  Let me splain...
> | 0000000000000000000000000000 |  
> 11111111111111111111111111111111111111111 | 2222222222222222222 ...
> C:\my\directory\before\geronimo\geronimo-1.1\repository 
> \com.apache.geronimo\console-1.1\appArtifacts
> The area in the 0's are controlled by the user and we need to leave  
> more headroom than a few characters so they can manage multiple  
> deployments of Geronimo; this could include multiple versions or  
> multiple deployments.  The users probably enjoy flexibility in  
> naming as much as we do.  We don't have control over this but we  
> influence how much headroom is available.
> The 1's is really the area we have control over as this is the  
> server proper.  This includes the area from the top of the tree to  
> the end of where the files we create end.  So, for instance, this  
> includes var, repository, etc.  Since were currently experiencing  
> this problem in the respository I think we should focus on this area.
> Finally, the 2's are the area that include the application and  
> Maven dependent information.  The Maven naming convention is  
> verbose.  The current implementation needs to be changed, the  
> question is how and can the change survive several releases so that  
> our users are not forced to change their deployments on each  
> subsequent release.  *One immediate thought I had was to place  
> applications back into the config-store (or equivalent name).   
> Rather than simply use a number as we did previously perhaps the  
> configId of the deployment would be appropriate.  Its human  
> readable and would be shorter than the current maven structure.*  I  
> highlighted the previous as I think this is the best option based  
> on what I know today.
> Perhaps there some way to provide a Maven abstraction that would  
> map Maven dir names to an internal format for us.  I expect if we  
> are running into this its only a matter of time befoew other Maven  
> users experience the same issues.  For us its the nesting of Maven  
> articacts / configurations that is causing us the problem.  Jason,  
> thoughts?
> Whatever we decide we need to ensure that it is stable enough to  
> work for a period of time.
> Matt
> Dain Sundstrom wrote:
>> Man I hate Windows....
>> Anyway, if you have a real OS and list the files in an assembly,  
>> you  will see that the problem is caused by the combination of  
>> two  changes: we now keep configurations in the repository and we  
>> unpack  them. If you look closer you will see that the big  
>> offenders are  unpacked ears and wars.
>> I believe the following are the longest paths in the server:
>> (270)
>> geronimo-1.1-SNAPSHOT/repository/geronimo/daytrader-derby-jetty/ 
>> 1.1- SNAPSHOT/ 
>> web-1.1- SNAPSHOT.war/META-INF/geronimo-generated/org/apache/ 
>> geronimo/axis/ client/GenericServiceEndpointWrapper$ 
>> $EnhancerByCGLIB$$36344d29.class
>> (264)
>> geronimo-1.1-SNAPSHOT/repository/geronimo/webconsole-jetty/1.1-  
>> standard-1.1-SNAPSHOT.war/WEB-INF/classes/org/apache/geronimo/ 
>> console/ databasemanager/wizard/DatabasePoolPortlet 
>> $ResourceAdapterParams.class
>> One thing to note here is that the longest paths are all classes   
>> generated by Geronimo, nested classes in wars or compiled JSP  
>> pages.   Someone should look into makeing maven jar the latter two  
>> and  Geronimo should be creating jars when generating classes  
>> (actually we  should stop generating classes a head of time but  
>> that is another  story).
>> Breaking down the longest path, we have:
>> GeronimoName (22)
>>   geronimo-1.1-SNAPSHOT
>> RepositoryPath (55)
>>   repository/geronimo/daytrader-derby-jetty/1.1-SNAPSHOT
>> FileName (39)
>> NestedPath (154)
>>   daytrader-web-1.1-SNAPSHOT.war/META-INF/geronimo-generated/org/  
>> apache/geronimo/axis/client/GenericServiceEndpointWrapper$  
>> $EnhancerByCGLIB$$36344d29.class
>> The first thing to note is if we simply replace "SNAPSHOT" with  
>> "0",  we drop 28 characters which makes the longest path 242; not  
>> enough  head room.  Of course, when we switch our groupId to the  
>> maven  standard org.apache.geronimo we eat up 20 more characters.   
>> If we are  going to unpack war files there is very little we can  
>> do about the  NestedPath, so we have very few choices left.  If we  
>> simply combine  combine ${GeronimoName}/${FileName}/${NestedPath}  
>> we are up to 115  characters leaving only 41 characters for  
>> anything else, but when you  add back the 28 from "SNAPSHOT", you  
>> get to a more comfortable level.
>> I think if we combine this problem with Sachin's request for a   
>> separate directory for applications, we could do something like this:
>> ${GeronimoName}/apps/${FileName}/${NestedPath}
>> There are several problems with this.  I think users will confuse  
>> the  hot-deploy directory "deploy" with the "apps" directory [1].   
>> Then  again, if you look at the problem configurations they are  
>> all apps  the users may want to remove (sample apps and the  
>> console), so may be  we should just put these in the hot-deploy  
>> directory.  Another  problem is that it will be much more  
>> difficult to query a repository  without a directory structure.   
>> The server will basically have to  read the configuration from  
>> these apps on startup to determine what  they are, so again we may  
>> just want to use the hot-deploy directory.   I'm not a fan of the  
>> hot-deploy directory, but I'm not sure there is  a better solution.
>> Again I renew my hate of Windows...
>> /me shakes his fist at Bill Gates
>> -dain
>> [1] As a side issue, I prefer the name "apps" because it will be  
>> most  familiar to tomcat users.

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