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From Rodent of Unusual Size <Ken.C...@Golux.Com>
Subject Re: [VOTE] accept donation of a business process engine into the ServiceMix project
Date Fri, 03 Feb 2006 11:33:48 GMT
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James Strachan wrote:
> On 3 Feb 2006, at 09:18, Sanjiva Weerawarana wrote:
> 
>>Absolutely -1: The first time I ever saw any of this topic was
>>Wed, 1 Feb 2006 12:20:32 -0700  (Thu, 01:20 LKT)
>>and now at
>>Thu, 2 Feb 2006 16:22:28 +0000  (22:22 LKT)
>>you want to have a vote on it? You've GOT to be kidding.
> 
> I called a vote to see what people thought about it, particularly the  
> project sponsor, the geronimo PMC.

You don't vote to get opinions or discussion.  The actual
text being voted on was:

    "accept the donation into the ServiceMix incubator project"

>>The idea of incubation is that the project is still not
>>a part of Apache and hasn't quite become a meritocracy etc..
> 
> I understand that, which is why we are asking for the sponsor, the  
> Geronimo PMC to vote.

That's very convoluted to my mind, although it *is* currently
early in the morning here.  A package gets accepted as a podling,
and then later the sponsor, a group external to the podling,
decides to add more to it?  Admittedly the podling itself isn't
allowed to make the decision, but that's still an odd scenario.
Regardless of whether it has happened before, it's clearly
an exception rather than the rule, and therefore subject to
scrutiny.

>>The way this particular potential donation has been handled proves
>>without a shadow of a doubt that this project (ServiceMix) is not
>>running The Apache Way.
> 
> Huh? We've held a vote in open so folks can express their opinions.

Again -- you don't use a vote to discuss or collect opinions.
Votes are primarily for decision-making, and this one
certainly was phrased that way.

> I don't see how the project is not following the Apache Way. I find  
> this comment particularly puzzling as you voted yourself in to be a  
> mentor of the ServiceMix project.

And I find it particularly troubling that a mentor of the
podling in question is so strongly opposed to this tack.
If Sanjiva, a mentor of ServiceMix and therefore supposedly
closer to it than most.. if *he* thinks there's something
awkward about the way this is being handled, then I think
attention should be paid to him.
- --
#ken	P-)}

Ken Coar, Sanagendamgagwedweinini  http://Ken.Coar.Org/
Author, developer, opinionist      http://Apache-Server.Com/

"Millennium hand and shrimp!"
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