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From "Jesse Beaumont" <Jesse.Beaum...@edina.co.uk>
Subject RE: new console-swing team
Date Fri, 21 Nov 2003 19:09:23 GMT

I'm definitely willing to help out if required, though I'm afraid I'd classify as a newcomer,
being, like Alex, a thin client man myself (...facing a mountainous learning curve, but that's
what it's all about, right?)  

I don't really want to get into the whole SWT vs. Swing thing (plenty of Eclipse vs NetBeans
rants out there) but my personal preference would be Swing simply because otherwise we have
to distribute the SWT libs.  I don't know that the looks of Swing need necessarily be poorer
than SWT though I agree it is probably easier to make SWT look good (see www.jgoodies.com
or the dev release of NetBeans).

I know I'll probably be shot to pieces for suggesting this, but what about JSF?  I know it
is currently aimed primarily at the web, but it is intended in theory at least to support
any rendering technology including Swing and possibly even SWT.

Jesse



-----Original Message-----
From: Matt Kurjanowicz [mailto:mkurjano@cc.gatech.edu] 
Sent: 21 November 2003 18:37
To: geronimo-dev@incubator.apache.org
Subject: Re: new console-swing team

I'd prefer to do webstart - that's just me, I've never liked applets.
I'm already a developer at service-cache, so we can host it there.  The only
caveat is that there everything is licensed as the Academic Free License (v.
2.0).  I'd rather stick with that then use the ASL v.1.1.

Also, it looks like the current "Explorer" is written in a java scripting
language called Groovy (see http://groovy.codehaus.org/) I don't know if
we'd want to keep that, or start going from scratch on a pure-Java
version...

As far as eclipse goes, the binaries aren't _that_ large, but I think we'd
have to look at distributing them tho because of license issues. (I don't
know how compatible their license is with ASL).
-Matt K.
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Sonnek, Ryan" <Ryan.Sonnek@bpc.com>
To: <geronimo-dev@incubator.apache.org>
Sent: Friday, November 21, 2003 1:29 PM
Subject: RE: new console-swing team


> I've worked with swing quite a bit (and actually like it suprisingly), but
I
> have not worked with SWT.  I don't know any possible downfalls EXCEPT that
> the SWT libraries will need to be distributed with the app.  I don't know
> how big they are, but I'm sure it's not a big deal.
>
> Could this new module be worked upon at the sourceforge project
> (service-cache) alongside the console-web?  This would allow non-ASF
> commiters to progress on it, and submit patches and updates to the
geronimo
> project.  Any opinions on applet vs. webstart? I think it'd be great to
have
> the web console "lauch" the webstart client through a link....
>
> Ryan
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Matt Kurjanowicz [mailto:mkurjano@cc.gatech.edu]
> Sent: Friday, November 21, 2003 12:21 PM
> To: geronimo-dev@incubator.apache.org; mariano.kamp@acm.org
> Subject: Re: new console-swing team
>
>
> I think that's a good idea - maybe we could use SWT instead of Swing in
> general for a GUI console - I've never actually written an eclipse plugin
> before, but if it's already in SWT it can't be that hard to convert it to
a
> plug-in, can it? Besides, I think that SWT looks better in general - what
> are the downsides to using SWT as opposed to Swing? -Matt
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Mariano Kamp" <mkamp@gmx.de>
> To: <geronimo-dev@incubator.apache.org>
> Sent: Friday, November 21, 2003 1:12 PM
> Subject: Re: new console-swing team
>
>
> > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> > Hash: SHA1
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> >   what about an eclipse-plugin? I am currently working on doing a
> > JSR-77 client for eclipse (will post something on Sunday). I
> > personally favor to have the console integrated in the ide. I do
> > understand though, that
> eclipse
> > is not everybodys choice.
> >
> > Cheers,
> > Mariano
> >
> > On Friday 21 November 2003 19:11, Matthew David Kurjanowicz wrote:
> > > Oh oh, pick me! pick me! :)  I really think that this is a good
> > > idea,
> and
> > > a good alternative (for me developing) to the twiddle comand client.
> > > There are a few things there that I've been trying to figure out
> > > there that just aren't working dealing with the twiddle cli - such
> > > as keeping track of state, etc.  Besides, I have more experience
> > > developing swing UI's then CLI interfaces.
> > >
> > > I'm willing to lead work on a swing console, and hopefully will be
> > > able
> to
> > > extend James' code.  I started looking at it last night and it looks
> > > doable.
> > >
> > > Hoeffenlich geht es gut. (And that's the extent of my memory of HS
> Deutsch
> > >
> > > :) ).
> > >
> > > -Matt K.
> > >
> > > > Cool, James.  That's great news.  MVC is perfect for thick-client
> > > > UIs, too : ) Now everyone who wants to scratch that itch can do so
> > > > (ich
> habe
> > > > es genug für mich gekratzt).
> > > >
> > > > It sounds like Matt and Ryan are already thinking a lot about this
> > > > stuff.  Does one (or both) of them want to lead the effort on
> developing
> > > > the swing UI?  (I'm sure James will if they won't, and will help
> > > > them
> if
> > > > they run across any issues).  There are probably dozens of people
> > > > on
> the
> > > > list who want to help with the Swing UI, who have a lot of
> > > > experience with UI design or who know JMX like the back of their
> > > > hand.  If not, this is a perfect chance for newcomers to get
> > > > involved (other than writing unit tests) and learn some new
> > > > skills.
> > > >
> > > > Matt and Ryan are both very competent developers and show a lot of
> > > > initiative for pushing in this direction : )  If it sounded before
> like
> > > > I was suggesting that the Geronimo project shouldn't have a swing
> > > > UI,
> I
> > > > apologize--you guys should know that wasn't what I was trying to
> > > > say (and even if I were, I don't make decisions around here ; )  I
> > > > never want to close the door on new ideas or new, useful
> > > > components to plug in.  I think that stuff is great.  I was just
> > > > trying to convey that I personally specialize in thin client
> > > > servlet approaches and will stick with them because it's where I
> > > > operate most efficiently and can make
> the
> > > > best use of my time.  I'd probably be more of a hindrance than a
> benefit
> > > > to skilled a thick-client UI team.
> > > >
> > > > Again, thanks for the help and the great work, James. Best luck to
> Matt
> > > > & Ryan on driving the swing effort if they choose to do so.  If
> > > > they have specific ideas down the line of ways they could reuse
> > > > pieces of
> my
> > > > code and want me to help abstract out bits for their use, I will
> > > > do whatever I can to help them. -- N.
> > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> > Version: GnuPG v1.2.3 (GNU/Linux)
> >
> > iD8DBQE/vlWtSraqt+SsFIMRAlKJAJsGYIbc2pB7qQgf9cn5SdJ1V/MbqACdGs6g
> > JUesP92W2htblsRtTUCyc/A=
> > =kHli
> > -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
> >
> >
> >
>
>


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