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From Jonathan Duty <jd...@jonandkerry.com>
Subject Re: RES: J2EE deployment verifier
Date Mon, 11 Aug 2003 17:11:55 GMT
Denes,
Yes, the arrow means uses.  As for the term "deployment manager", I got 
that from Weston's earlier e-mail

Excerpt from Weston Price:

"I have thought of it in terms of a deployment manager (as Chris alluded to 
earlier this morning). The manager would be responsible for coordinating the 
interaction between the verification engine and the deployment engine....sort 
of a controller,that way the two can be loosely coupled relying on an 
external agent to provide an higher level of service"

Basically the DeploymentManager would first Send the archive into the Verification Engine
to make sure it was assembled correctly.  If that passed then the Deployment Manager would
send the archive into the deployment engine to actually be deployed into Gerinomo.  

A point to note is that the Verification engine can also be used in other places, like Weston
said.  We could make it an Ant task, or attach it to this gerinomo gui so developers could
verify their archive before sending it to Gerinomo for deployment.

~Jonathan


Denes wrote:

>If the arrows means "uses" I think that's right.
>
>Not sure about what DeploymentManager really is. Is it the deploy tool,
>some daemon on server, or both?
>
>Denes
>
>
>  
>
>>-----Mensagem original-----
>>De: Jonathan Duty [mailto:jduty@jonandkerry.com]
>>Enviada em: segunda-feira, 11 de agosto de 2003 13:49
>>Para: geronimo-dev@incubator.apache.org
>>Assunto: Re: J2EE deployment verifier
>>
>>Since I'm weird and think better in pictures, I tried to draw what you
>>were describing.  Do I have the correct Idea of your vision?
>>The image is attached.  Hope this helps others out also.
>>~Jonathan
>>
>>
>>
>>Weston M. Price wrote:
>>
>>    
>>
>>>I have thought of it in terms of a deployment manager (as Chris
>>>      
>>>
>alluded
>  
>
>>to
>>    
>>
>>>earlier this morning). The manager would be responsible for
>>>      
>>>
>coordinating
>  
>
>>the
>>    
>>
>>>interaction between the verification engine and the deployment
>>>      
>>>
>>engine....sort
>>    
>>
>>>of a controller, that way the two can be loosely coupled relying on
>>>      
>>>
>an
>  
>
>>>external agent to provide an higher level of service, in this case
>>>      
>>>
>the
>  
>
>>>complete deployment of a J2EE archive.
>>>
>>>Weston
>>>
>>>On Monday 11 August 2003 04:05 pm, Labeeb Syed wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>      
>>>
>>>>In this scenario, the verifier will have to interface
>>>>with the deployer. I would definitely like to
>>>>implement the SPI for the deployer.
>>>>
>>>>Q: Should the deployer be responsible for ensuring
>>>>bean consistency, e.g., entity bean cmr mapping vs
>>>>databases and relational mappings, or any such other
>>>>technical issues (realms checking, etc.)?
>>>>
>>>>Chris, if this is what we'd work on, I'd like to come
>>>>up with a list potential technical problems we could
>>>>encounter to ensure just integrity of the DD file.
>>>>
>>>>Labeeb Syed
>>>>
>>>>--- Chris Opacki <chris_opacki@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>        
>>>>
>>>>>That is exactly what i was thinking. This is the
>>>>>object model that has been defined in the deployment
>>>>>spec... under Tool Provider Interfaces. There are
>>>>>also
>>>>>some other classes, exceptions and interfaces that
>>>>>both modules might use.
>>>>>
>>>>>--- "Weston M. Price" <weston_p@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>>>>>But I do agree that the two teams must work
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>            
>>>>>>
>>>>>closely
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>>>>>together....Chris made an
>>>>>>excellent point in indetifying that there are
>>>>>>certain basic facilities that
>>>>>>we can use together....I think if we can agree on
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>            
>>>>>>
>>>>>a
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>>>>>common object model for
>>>>>>archive formats (EAR, WAR, SAR) then we could
>>>>>>probably develop our own
>>>>>>streams, attributes, behavior.....
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Weston
>>>>>>
>>>>>>On Monday 11 August 2003 03:18 pm, Chris Opacki
>>>>>>
>>>>>>wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>            
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Ditto on all of that! Quite honestly...the
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>              
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>deployer
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>            
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>shouldn't run...period...until the verifier has
>>>>>>>run...its a good idea that the deployableobject
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>              
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>are
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>            
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>build from within a controller that sends them
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>              
>>>>>>>
>>>>>to
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>>>>>the
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>            
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>verifier for verification and then to the
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>              
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>deployer.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>            
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Something along that lines at a high level. we
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>              
>>>>>>>
>>>>>can
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>>>>>>reuse both engines for CLI and the GUI.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>--- Jonathan Duty <jduty@jonandkerry.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>              
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>+1 You've convinced me.  That would be a bad
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>a$$
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>tool to have as a
>>>>>>>>developer.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Plus, the deployment team could use it if they
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>want
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>            
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>to verify the
>>>>>>>>archive schema before they start deploying it.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Count me in!
>>>>>>>>~Jonathan
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Jonathan Duty
>>>>>>>>Software Developer - eWashtenaw
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>From: Weston M. Price
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>[mailto:weston_p@yahoo.com]
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>            
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Sent: Monday, August 11, 2003 6:41 AM
>>>>>>>>To: geronimo-dev@incubator.apache.org
>>>>>>>>Subject: Re: J2EE deployment verifier
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>I agree completely. I think what we are
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>talking
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>about are two modules
>>>>>>>>that are
>>>>>>>>close cousins. The verification manager is
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>again,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>            
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>the "front-line" of
>>>>>>>>defense
>>>>>>>>for the deployment manager. I would assume the
>>>>>>>>deployment manager would
>>>>>>>>deal
>>>>>>>>with critical errors such as
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>LinkageConstraints,
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>incorrect classfile
>>>>>>>>versions
>>>>>>>>etc. while the verfication manager will handle
>>>>>>>>actual semantic
>>>>>>>>fallibities in
>>>>>>>>the deployment descriptors based upon the
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>existing
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>            
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>specifications.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>	The reason I mentioned a seperate
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>verification
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>module was that I
>>>>>>>>would
>>>>>>>>developers (hell, I know I would) like an
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>engine
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>that given a deployment
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>platform could validate their archive before
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>ever
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>            
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>trying to drop it in
>>>>>>>>the
>>>>>>>>chute. This would save a lot of time largely
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>due
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>>>>>to
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>            
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>the fact that XML
>>>>>>>>descriptors are not typed and you don't know
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>if
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>>>>>they
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>            
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>are "correct" at
>>>>>>>>compile
>>>>>>>>time. I suppose the biggest win in all of this
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>in my
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>            
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>opion would be to
>>>>>>>>provide hooks for an ANT task that would
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>verify
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>>>>>the
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>            
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>archive during
>>>>>>>>compile
>>>>>>>>time.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Regards,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Weston
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>On Monday 11 August 2003 02:39 pm, Jonathan
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>Duty
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Why couldn't they be close friends. Could
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>                  
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>this
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>verifier, even as a
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>separate module, be a subset of the deploy
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>                  
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>module?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>            
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>I mean we don't
>>>>>>>>want
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>to deploy something that the J2EE server
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>                  
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>will
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>>>>>not
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>            
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>accept.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Maybe these 2 groups should work close
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>                  
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>together.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>            
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>~Jonathan
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>From: Chris Opacki
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>                  
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>[mailto:chris_opacki@yahoo.com]
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>            
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Sent: Monday, August 11, 2003 10:23 AM
>>>>>>>>>To: geronimo-dev@incubator.apache.org
>>>>>>>>>Subject: RE: J2EE deployment verifier
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>My bad...I was assuming the deploy tool and
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>                  
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>the
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>            
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>verifier would be close friends.
>>>>>>>>>;)
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>--- Srihari S <sriharis@blr.pin.philips.com>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>                  
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>True
>>>>>>>>>>Our module is just going to check and
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>                    
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>declare
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>            
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>whether or not a given unit of
>>>>>>>>>>deployment
>>>>>>>>>>is deployable on a j2ee server or not.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>Nothing more..nothing less.
>>>>>>>>>>Building this unit will be our
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>                    
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>mission..right
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>            
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>weston??
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>>From: Weston M. Price
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>                    
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>[mailto:weston_p@yahoo.com]
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>Sent: Monday, August 11, 2003 3:05 PM
>>>>>>>>>>To: geronimo-dev@incubator.apache.org
>>>>>>>>>>Subject: Re: J2EE deployment verifier
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>And even further, let's clarify the
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>                    
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>verification
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>            
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>is
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>a completely different
>>>>>>>>>>animal than actual deployment. Am I
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>                    
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>correct
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>>>>>on
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>            
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>this
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>one at least in terms of
>>>>>>>>>>the way we are thinking about this module?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>Weston
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>                    
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>=== message truncated ===
>>>>
>>>>
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