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From "Gareth Bryan" <garethbr...@fastmail.fm>
Subject Re: User Friendliness
Date Mon, 11 Aug 2003 10:41:01 GMT
I'm not a 77 / 88 expert but I definately agree with this.

Obviously, geronimo must support these two specs container-side, so it
makes sense to utilize these admin-side.  I believe (but I have to go off
and check) that 77 & 88 alow some flexibility for value-add.

Regards,

Gareth

On Mon, 11 Aug 2003 03:27:07 -0700 (PDT), "Dirk Laessig"
<dirk@laessig.com> said:
> Hi there,
> 
> an administration client could be based on the JSR-77
> and JSR-88 (J2EE Management and J2EE Deployment).
> Before we start coding a Geronimo-specific protocol
> between the admin client and the server, we can
> investigate if these standards are flexible enough for
> this task. 
> 
> JSR-77 provides as simple management model, which can
> be extended by the implementing app server. It also
> defines a session bean interface for accessing these
> managed objects in the server. I think that Geronimo
> can just extend this JSR-77 model to provide enough
> user friendliness in the admin client. 
> 
> What do you think?
> 
> Cheers,
> Dirk
> 
> On Sat, 09 Aug 2003 21:28:53 -0500, Tim Urberg wrote:
> 
> > 
> > Let me know how I can help with this...once again, the
> > OpenEJB code base 
> >   already contains a web administration.
> > 
> > Tim Urberg
> > 
> > Richard Monson-Haefel wrote:
> > > Erin,
> > > 
> > > I think your focus on User Friendliness is of
> critial
> > importance. I also think
> > > that it should be at the top of our priorities, not
> > something addressed later.
> > > This has been my experience with just about all
> > applicaiton servers: they are
> > > just too complex. I hate the fact that I have spend
> > hours learning how to run an
> > > App server before I can use it effectively.  The
> root
> > of the problem is
> > > configuration.
> > > 
> > > Here are some ideas for User Frindlenss
> > > 1. Configuration should be done by exception, rather
> > than by feature. In other
> > > words, everything has an assumed value unless its
> > explicitly configured.
> > > 
> > > 2. Configuration files are terse to the extreem and
> > are not hiarchial. Instead
> > > of using XML, use a english like syntax with very
> > simple rules. For example, the
> > > following would set the timeout on a specific
> > deployment.
> > > 
> > > Set ApplicationA.ejb.Account timeout=3600
> > > Set ApplicationA.container.InstancePool
> max_count=150
> > > 
> > > 3. Configuration files can be anywhere and can be
> > split up in any way. This
> > > would allow people to centrailize configuration or
> > otherwise use their own
> > > policies (e.g. one configuration file or J2EE
> > application, or funtionality or
> > > something else). The fact that configuration options
> > are flat (all a the same
> > > level) makes it easy to combine many configuration
> > files into a whole.
> > > 
> > > 4. Include a very simple admin cousole that anyone
> > can figure out. What makes
> > > this possible is the fact that only exceptions are
> > configured, so you don't have
> > > to go through and fill out a bunch of fields
> > everytime you want to deploy an app
> > > or start the server.
> > > 
> > > In my opinion Geronimo should have four axioms that
> > drive every technical
> > > decision:
> > > 
> > > - User Friendliness,
> > > - Conformance
> > > - Performance, and
> > >  -Plugability.
> > > 
> > > These are all at the same level, with no one axiom
> > being more important than the
> > > others.  Different groups might be responsible for
> > ensuring that all components
> > > (parts of Geronimo) embrace all four axioms.  These
> > would be gatekeepers to
> > > adding new functionality - I don't mean to create
> > more red tap, but only to
> > > ensure that we stick to the axioms..
> > > 
> > > Richard
> > > 
> 
> --
> Dirk Laessig <dirk@laessig.com>
> http://www.laessig.com
-- 
  Gareth Bryan
  garethbryan@fastmail.fm

-- 
http://www.fastmail.fm - Faster than the air-speed velocity of an
                          unladen european swallow

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