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From "Glen Tulukin" <g...@iteclectic.com>
Subject Re: commercial Forrest skins?
Date Tue, 30 Nov 2004 16:28:38 GMT

"David Crossley" <crossley@apache.org> wrote in message
news:41AC1EBC.909@apache.org...
> Glen Tulukin wrote:
> > I am not a frequent visitor of this forum and thus I do not know the
"common
> > denominator" opinion but I think it's wrong that you restrict Forrest to
the
> > purpose of documentation generation only.
>
> Where do you get the idea that we restrict Forrest?
> Is there something in our documentation that we need
> to change?
"Apache Forrest is an XML standards-oriented documentation framework based
upon Apache Cocoon, providing XSLT stylesheets and schemas, images and other
resources. Forrest uses these to render the source content into a website
via command-line, robot, or dynamic application. " -- it's on the
forrest.apache.org. The word "documentation" is restrictive/confusing for a
new commer. I am lucky to have Vadim Gritsenko in the next cubical (he is
frequent contributor to Cocoon, if somebody does not know) who can explain
that "Forrest is Cocoon plus three skins plus ready-to-use sitemap. Do with
Forrest whatever you would do with Cocoon. People mainly use it for
documentation and you are the first one I know who uses Forrest for _real_
website generation."

> > I use Forrest for production web site generation -- I do it for my
client.
> > Client submits me xml file they edit in the XML Spy with linked
> > document-v12.dtd and a freelancer/web designer updates css from time to
> > time. I regenerate site and ftp it to ISP. I know that some other people
I
> > met at local XML group do more or less the same.
>
> Isn't that still "documentation generation"?
No, they (my client) connect XMLSpy to the corporate database and generate
XMLs -- list of products, services, discounts, questions for forms, etc.
It's a real thing, the  XML documents are not documents per se in that sense
they are not written by a content provider or tech writer -- they are
snapshots of the production database. A custom transformer calls ILOG Rule
Engine that has rules how to combine different components and generate a
service or product offering. The only xdoc they wrote is "about us" --
everything else comes from MS SQL Server via rule engine transformer as a
step in the pipe.


> > I had to clean-up Forrest
> > xslt's to make them more Internet-oriented as opposite to be
> > documentation-oriented. Namely, use DIV instead of tables, remove
comments,
>
> That indicates to me that you are using one of the old
> deprecated skins. Please heed the warnings and investigate
> the "pelt" skin.
I use whatever in the last official release, "pelt" is not there but I'll
take a look.

> > have separate windows title and document title, introduce keywords and
> > provide report how many times they used and in which paragraph (search
> > engines savvy) -- just to name few things from the big list you can find
on
> > a good search-engine optimization web site...
>
> Patches are welcome.
Then welcome more patchers with more attractive product idea. I suggest to
replace "documentation" with "content generation and management": "Apache
Forrest is an XML standards-oriented ***content generation and management***
framework based upon Apache Cocoon, providing XSLT stylesheets and schemas,
images and other resources. Forrest uses these to render the source content
into a website via command-line, robot, or dynamic application. "

Glen




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