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From Thorsten Scherler <>
Subject Re: direction of forrest
Date Mon, 16 Jul 2007 20:51:15 GMT
On Mon, 2007-07-16 at 08:16 -0400, Tim Williams wrote:
> With limited spare time I've been struggling to figure out where/how
> Forrest concerns me anymore.  I thought its relevance to me is waning.
>  I thought its relevance in general may also be waning.   I mean, I
> realize that Forrest has much more to offer, but still, I look at
> projects like Exhibit[2] and wonder if we're on the wrong path.

I think I know what you mean but can you explain a wee bit more? I mean
Exhibit is a firefox/xul application. In the end this means exchange
cocoon for firefox as underlying framework? 

The one wonderful think that cocoon still is awesome at is that you are
not bind to ONE browser. Exhibit and similar project of the MIT are
bound to XUL. 

I personally starting to like xul but is cocoon really obsolete?

> There's been a number of emails that make me question whether that's
> true or not.  We have some interesting code in Forrest2.  We have
> Thorsten talking[1] about using PoJo/Spring in dispatcher.  We have
> Ross beginning to integrate some Ajax-y code. 

Actually the good things of both approach is that it will easy to
integrate, meaning using the standalone dispatcher as presentation
framework and forrest2 as multi-channel publisher. 

> We obviously discussed
> much of this before the release but it was thought best to just put it
> on the back-burner until after the release.  

After the release we fall in a comma (like it seems).

> Unfortunately, after the
> release, we seemed to focus on JIRA to answer "what's next"[3]. 

We tried to brainstorm but the discussion died through general
statements like the jira review you point out. 

>  Now,
> I've got nothing against JIRA, I just think we've got bigger "issues"
> than those currently captured in JIRA.

The think we never really decided is which road to go.

> So, I ask what's the future of forrest?  Is Forrest2 or some
> derivative the answer?  Status Quo?

I for one tend more in forrest2 direction then status quo. IMO cocoon is
suffering and will more in the future. Meaning projects based on it like
forrest and lenya are suffering as well. 

I believe the future of forrest lies in "bringing back cocoon 1" and
make it plugable. I am not sure whether exchanging cocoon for xul will
solve anything. I do not like program in javascript, I prefer java. 

However the current community is IMO in deep sleep. Our code is quite
stable which for me indicates the next release should be 1.0 with:

- build on ivy dependency management
- make core independent of theming engine (re-factory regarding
skins-plugin, all code of the core regarding skinning have to go to a
-- core build target 
-- core sitemaps
- internal format based on xhtml2

This brings us a stable branch and the next thing for me would be blueprint planning.

I mean if we manage to write a "documentation" before we write any code 
we can split task for coding.

Anyway ATM I am concentrating my spare time on lenya (we have a moment) but like said
above lenya is facing in the near future the same situation regarding cocoon. 

IMO I guess future development of lenya could very much use something like forrest2.


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> [2] -
> [3] -
Thorsten Scherler                       
Open Source Java                      consulting, training and solutions

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