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From Ross Gardler <>
Subject Re: Summer of Code
Date Thu, 02 Jun 2005 17:11:37 GMT
Mikler wrote:
> Hello!

Hi, because your mail discusses some additional ideas for Forrest I have
sent this response to the Forrest dev list for further comment.

If you are not already a member of the dev list you should join in order
to see other devs responses to your ideas.

> My name is Mikhail Kolesnik. I'm a student of Belorussian State
> University ( and I'm looking forward to participate in
> Summer of Code program of Google.
> (
> As i've understood from
> I should contact
> mentor before a applying, to devise some things like delivirable and
> time graph. Is that so?

Yes. See below for more.

> I'm writing to you about project:
>>Plugins to enable Forrest content to be output as speech and to be accessed via speech
> As far as i see there are already 3 persons are working on complete
> proposals that might be quite enough for such a work.

Yes, but only the best proposal will be accepted by Google (if any). If
you have an interest in that project then I am more than happy for you
to create a proposal as well. Of course there is more competition for it
in that case.

> So here are
> several more propositions for Forest enrichment.

We are willing to consider anything, and I like that you have enough
understanding of Forrest to be able to identify some perceived need, so
here goes...

> 1. Create more templates for Apache Forest. And make 'em more
> configurable. When I've used Forest for the first time, I was dissapointed by the lack
> templates it provides and it seemed really hard for me to create my
> own. I'm not a good designer - but this is a usefull idea

Do you mean skins? If so this is a non-starter as skins are going to be
deprecated in 0.8 in favour of a new things system called views.

You could consider doing some work on the views system, however I would
not be able to be the main mentor on this as I do not fully understand
how they work at present (they are a brand new development). Thortsen
who is leading the views effort will read this mail on the dev list, so
if he can see a project in this, and has the time to be a co-mentor, I
am sure he will let us know.

> 2. I do belive that most of end users woouldn't use apache forest,
> because it does not have any User Interface. At least for editing
> default template. But it is a good idea to create editor and some file
> format, that describes how to edit conents of the site that
> constructed upon any template. (each file for each new template). Hope
> I was clear :)

There are two aspects to this there is the editing of content and the
editing of Forrest configs.

With respect to editing content:

Forrest is a *publication* framework. Not an editing framework, it is
not within the goals of the Forrest project to become an editor for content.

That being said I am working on a plugin to use Forrest as the
publication engine for a the Daisy CMS, another committer (thorsten) is
working on integration with the Lenya CMS, and another person recently
expressed interest in integrating with Slide repositories.

It strikes me that there could be a project in that integration effort.
Something to create a standard way for Forrest to integrate with
repositories. There has been some discussion on this on the dev mailing
list recently.

It may also be worth considering JSR-170 integration.

The problem with all these is that since there are existing committers
working on them we can assume that they have a need for it. If that need
is urgent they may have completed the work before the Summer of Code
exercise starts.

With respect to an editor for aspects of Forrest other than content
(i.e. skins, config files etc.) We do have an alpha quality Eclipse
plugin in our whiteboard. All this does at present is seed a site,
start/stop the server and build the static site. It was donated from
another project that also has a site editor, but the structure of the
site descriptor is different from that used in Forrest.

A proposal to extend this to allow editing of the config files, site
files, add new wizards and help manage the new views configuration would
be considered very important (at least by me, and I would certainly be
willing to be the mentor on this one).


If you would like to create a proposal for any of the above then we need
to follow the following process:

- student gains an overview understanding of the technologies involved
in the proposal

- student expands the initial project outline to a draft proposal text:
     - description of problem
     - description of a proposed solution
     - benefits of the solution to the Apache community
     - an approach
         - milestones in delivery
         - expected time line for delivery
     - description of relevant students skills

- student and mentors work together to finalise this proposal

- proposal is submitted to project community for comment/approval

- student registers the proposal with Google via their website

The deadline for the proposal is June 14th and the refinement of the
draft proposal will probably take more than a week. So there is no time
to spare.

I look forward to receiving your initial *draft* proposal. I stress
draft as you should not feel pressured by this it is only a starting
point for our discussions. Do not waste time trying to make it perfect,
that will happen as we discuss, it is more important that you show how
much of the project you already understand so that we know where to
start discussing.


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