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From David Crossley <>
Subject Re: [PROPOSAL] A CMS for our Docs
Date Tue, 07 Jun 2005 07:25:16 GMT
Nicola Ken Barozzi wrote:
> David Crossley wrote:
> >Nicola Ken Barozzi wrote:
> >>David Crossley wrote:
> >>...
> >>>I find this very alarming. Some people at Infrastructure are
> >>>trying to get a cross-project environment established for managing
> >>>documentation tools and site-building. All PMCs were asked to
> >>>join and discuss this. Some people have, but mainly the process
> >>>has stalled again.
> >>
> >>Because it's discussion instead of DIY.
> >
> >Necessary discussion. The main issue was/is trying to solve how
> >ASF projects can conduct oversight of the content, how the tools
> >would get maintained, and oversight of the publishing process.
> >That is a requirement.
> But it's not a requirement that experimentation stops in the meantime.

I agree.

> You have called this "alarming", I disagree.

My alarm is about duplication (multiplication) of effort.

> I would be alarmed if, once 
> the rules are decided, people would not want to follow them. But before 
> that, stopping things is only harmful.
> As soon as new needs come out from site-dev, please relay them here, so 
> that we can make the system compliant with the requirements.

Sorry, i don't have the energy to be a go-between.

> >>>Instead we see projects like Cocoon rushing off to do their
> >>>own thing. Now we will get duplicate instances of Daisy/Forrest.
> >>
> >>I find it very constructive that people are rushing to make it work. 
> >>Consolidation can come later.
> >
> >Good in theory. In my OSS experience "consolidation" never happens.
> >People rush on to the next new thing.
> In my -personal- experience, discussions rarely lead to action.

I know what you mean. I got sick of discussions and acted instead
to set up the forrestbot on brutus. Now that is gone because of
tangential infrastructure issues. I had to set it up all over again
at yet another temporary place in my home directory on our zone.
Some prior planning and discussion might have helped to have
a permanent home. Somehow we need to find the right mixture of
discussion and action. The holy grail of OSS.


> How long have I talked about the locationmap? Have I ever done anything 
> concrete on it? How long has the Doco document been waiting? How much 
> time has passed since the first mail on
> >>Would it be better just to see this as an experiment, and not (yet) 
> >>really move the docs there till we have a vote with a working system and 
> >>a plan?
> >
> >Perhaps we should start with a specific set of user-oriented
> >documents, and leave the core docs in the current system.
> We can start using it as a "super wiki", I agree.
> -- 
> Nicola Ken Barozzi         
>             - verba volant, scripta manent -
>    (discussions get forgotten, just code remains)
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------

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