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From David Crossley <>
Subject Re: 2nd generation skinning - view and leather
Date Tue, 05 Apr 2005 11:49:32 GMT
Thorsten Scherler wrote:
> Ross Gardler wrote:
> > Thorsten Scherler wrote:
> > 
> > > If somebody have some spare time and want to help us with the "2nd
> > > generation skinning" you can:
> > 
> > I will certainly be helping out, but not until 0.7 is released. Once
> > that is done this is right at the top of my ToDo list.
> Dude, no hurries. 
> You know more or less know what I am trying to do. Now I need more
> devs/user and committer (junior/senior) looking in the stuff and give
> me/us feedback.

Yes, calling all people on the dev list, not just the committers.

> I think it would be a good idea to plan the view/leather as default
> skinning mechanism for 0.8. That would makes it possible to develop the
> skinning engine for 0.9 and have a stable version on our 1.0. :)

Actually, we might need to go 0.8 0.9 0.10 0.11 1.0
Release often.

> ...but for that I need some eyes on the code and NOT ONLY yours and
> mine!!! Actually I wish especially that Nicola would have a look and
> play devils advocate. ;-)
> David had a look on it this morning (I am still waiting for things you
> do [not] like). ;-) 

Sure, i will try again soon.

> Sorry for being pain in the a***, but I need some enhancement suggestion
> because I am relative happy with the concept but not really with my
> implementation (it is still proof of concept). ;-)

As NKB said, just get on with it, we can always change later.
Is the plugin marked with its status in some way, so that
people don't rely on it when it goes out with the 0.7 release?


> One important thing IMO is to officially define an interface for skins
> and views. Leather has it (e.g.
> cocoon://get.contract.{contract-name}.{format}) but as well contains the
> implementations. I reckon the given example match would be better of in
> the view plugin which define the interface.
> New skins would need only to provide new implementations of contracts
> and not define the interface again. That will make it necessary to
> change some matches but actually I only have not implemented it yet to
> not deciding the future of skins all by myself and bringing more
> complexity to the things I am doing.
> Talking about complexity, I was teaching my students the MVC pattern and
> must admit that I see our nuggets as result of models. This models
> depend on the document specific meta data (forrest:properties). They
> deliver our intermediate format. 
> Now the view/leather plugins are a mix of controller and view in my eyes
> that is the reason (I guess) Ross et. al. having problems to understand
> me because I am mixing things in the code and do not have a clear
> separation.
> ...and that is the reason why I need feedback. ;-)
> salu2
> -- 
> thorsten
> "Together we stand, divided we fall!" 
> Hey you (Pink Floyd)

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