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Date: Tue, 30 Nov 2004 17:16:07 +0000
From: Ross Gardler <rgardler@apache.org>
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Subject: Re: Lenya may start using Forrest Plugins
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Antonio Gallardo wrote:
> 2-Lenya is the "content manager". On the other hand, Forrest can be viewed
> as a content generator.

I see it differently, Forrest is a content publisher, it does not 
generate the content only a representation of the content.

> The content generated by Forrest must be managed
> by Lenya.

For me Lenya is a tool for content generation (driven by the user).

Lenya = excellent content managment
Forrest = excellent publishing engine

Lenya + Forrest = Killer App

> In that way, we need to "attach" Forrest to Lenya and no the
> oposite.

This is just semantics, it is best for us to steer away from such 
terminology as it will only generate (probably unspoken) arguments about 
which is the most important part. Lenya and Forrest both do vital and 
different jobs.

> That means we need to develop some tools that Lenya will use to
> "know how" call the tools and Forrest need to provide a support for this
> tools called by Lenya.

Forrest is driven, in its entirety, from URI requests. There is no need 
for Forrest to provide any additional support (pending further 
experimentation of course).

> 3-Forrest need to be able to generate only a desired document. Lenya will
> "tell" Forrest wich one by running the forrest tools.

It already does, just request the document you want (for example 
http://localhost:8888/mydoc.pdf or http://localhost:8888/mydoc.html)

> 4-From Lenya can be posible to call Forrest in the same way as we call use
> case. Here Flowscript can play an important role.

(I don't know what you mean by "call use case", but in responding to the 
flowscript comment I say - Too complicated, just make a request to a URI 
at the appropriate place in a controlling sitemap.

> 5-An interesting point to be solved is how to merge the Lenya "sitetree"
> with Forrest site.xml and tabs.xml. 

Write a Forrest plugin to generate site.xml and tabs.xml from sitetree 
(see IMSManifest plugin as an example, this creates site.xml and 
tabs.xml from an IMS Manifest file).

> Another posible solution is a
> synchronization of all this files or perhaps we can "forget about the tabs
> and site in the beggining and let lenya manage it. I am not sure if this
> will be more easy or complicated. I am also thinking that another
> posibility to include in this point the "linkmap.html" that forrest
> currently generate.

It seems to me that in all of your points you are thinking of Forrest 
running in a static mode, switch your thinking to Forrest running in a 
dynamic mode and everything becomes much easier (interestingly this is 
where you started by saying Forrest and Lenya can run in the same Cocoon 
instance).


>                                 -- 0 --
> 
> The other posible solution is import into Lenya some forrest plugins and
> similar as above let Lenya manage everything.

This is my thinking entirely. Unfortunately I do not understand Lenya 
enough yet to fully understand how easy/difficult this would be. I keep 
sitting down trying to do something with Lenya and then get distracted. 
Soon though...


>                                 -- 0 --
> 
> We need to start with a low profile if we want to make both work together.
> ;-)
> 
> WDYT?

I agree that a low profile is required until we actualy have something 
working. The more I look at the way Lenya works the more difficult it 
seems, but I am sure I will "get it" soon. So where you say "both work 
together" there are at least three of us ;-)

Ross

Ross