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From Upayavira ...@upaya.co.uk>
Subject Re: i18n errors, bad downgrading
Date Mon, 15 Mar 2004 09:19:28 GMT
Sjur Nørstebø Moshagen wrote:

> På 12. mar. 2004 kl. 13.34 skrev Juan Jose Pablos:
>
>>> in the request. (on the other hand, it can be useful to be _able_ to 
>>> access a specific localised file in this way, at least for debugging 
>>> purposes.)
>>
>>
>> Yes, but how do you plan to overwrite users locale settings? I can 
>> not find another way to overwrite user settings unless we incorporate 
>> the locale information on the filename.
>
>
> It has to be coded somewhere, either in the filename, or in the xml of 
> the file. I think it is pretty obvious that it should be in the 
> filename. Looking at the i18n examples of Cocoon (I finally installed 
> and tested;) the following file naming scheme is already in place for 
> catalogues:
>
> filename_{lang}_{country}_{variant}.xml
>
> There is no need to invent a different scheme for ordinary text files.

Yes, but that's the filenaming at the source side - not necessarily for 
serving. But, I guess if you wanted to configure your sitemap to avoid 
the header's locale, that would work.

>>>> 2) Forget Dynamic and only use static
>>>
>>> You can't be serious about that? ;)
>>
>>
>> In a previous discussion, It was define to focus on the creation of 
>> static content. So, yes Ï am serious.
>
> OK (but that should not stop us from trying to keep the two in sync).

Exactly. I agree that Forrest is about static not dynamic sites. But 
you've got to be really careful about how you define that. Dynamic to me 
means whether you are reading stuff from databases, etc, and every page 
you generate is different. As to static, I don't think it should matter 
whether the site is served by a servlet container or by Apache et al - a 
Forrest site should be independent of that, and should work on both. It 
should be environment independent. The discussion, as far as I remember 
it, was about the inclusion of stuff that would _only_ work in dynamic 
mode. You're suggesting adding stuff that will _only_ work in static 
mode - I think that is going way too far.

>> Think that the main use case is: You put a buch of xml files on a 
>> given directory and expect a full website to come out.
>
>
> Sure, but you loose the rapid development cycle with having a running 
> Forrest site where you can add/remove/change documents and see the 
> results immediately, instead of having to rebuild and run each time. 
> Anyway...
>
>>> That's fine, we just need to agree upon the behaviour of CLI when a 
>>> page is not found for a given locale - what should the output be?
>>
>>
>> Well, I am not sure, posibly just the filename without any locale.
>
> Agree, but what if you only have "localised" files (you don't want to 
> keep two identical copies of the same file in the src, one as default 
> without any locale info, and one with an explicit locale) - thus we 
> _also_ need a notion of a "default language" that could be used to 
> build default versions (as files without any locale in the file name).

What do you mean by "localised"? I think that it should be the 
environment's responsibility to handle downgrading, not the site itself.

>
>> There is not a i18nfile generator, so it needs to be added on the 
>> sitemap.
>
>
> I checked the Cocoon samples as well, and indeed, there does not seem 
> to be a mechanism (or sitemap action) in place for just choosing one 
> of several localised _files_. THANKS for helping me get this point, I 
> have been so sure that everything was in place, that I couldn't 
> believe what you've tried to tell me. Sorry;)

Regards, Upayavira



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