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From Nicola Ken Barozzi <>
Subject Re: file: prefix, take 2
Date Fri, 20 Dec 2002 07:35:51 GMT

Jeff Turner wrote:
> What I said about -1s is a
> completely generic belief I have formed after watching Avalon tear itself
> apart.  If my little rant about -1s were posted to avalon-dev in response
> to a PD/SC flamefest, I think you'd agree with it.

I do not think our discussion was a flamefest. I'm sad you took it as 
such, because I honestly took all my time to find a solution.

> I think you'll find if you _express_ your opinions without _forcing_ them
> via a -1, you'll get a much less defensive reaction.  I will personally
> revert anything you want to -0.9 until I've understood your point.

Then tell me, what is the reason why reverting it with a -1 feels much 
worse than with a -0.9?

A -0.9 means: you can keep it in, but I don't like it.
A -1 means: I really think it's a problem. Revert it because there are 
some issues I feel are very important, and I will discuss them to death 
to find a solution.

Negative -1s are ones that block things without trying to find a 
solution. I am really trying hard, and if you feel it's a waste of time, 
think about *my* time too.

I respect your opinions enough to reply to you each single time with a 
discussion trying to explain points *and* give a solution to the 

As anyone, I may be wrong, my -1 could be completely off target, but 
given the points that came through and the amount of ideas, I'm more 
than confident that in fact my veto has reason to be, because it 
demonstrates that the discussion on this important point in Forrest 
wasn't through.

I don't play with vetos, and if once I did a mistake, I immediately 
rectified it. If you stiull feel I'm doing it, then there is no way I 
can tell you it's not the case. I'm not able to explain myself better 
than this, sorry.

> For
> example, if I'd forced through the original patch I'd have never
> encountered that excellent bit of thinking about inverting sitemaps for
> CLI optimizations.

I gather that it would not have happened if I didn't force you to 
discuss with a -1. Don't think that forcing code in CVS makes people 
think. Discussions do.

I'm not going away, but again, I'm too disillusioned to find the force 
to discuss. I prefer to discuss these things on the Cocoon list, where 
we know why Cocoon works this way and what the meanings are, and where 
in fact we have already found a possible solution to the CLI speed.

>>Thank you all, but this is just too much.

I'm sorry, but after all the pushing I've been through these days, I 
just can't take anymore.

Nicola Ken Barozzi         
             - verba volant, scripta manent -
    (discussions get forgotten, just code remains)

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