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From Nicola Ken Barozzi <>
Subject Re: [RT] Getting rid of the table-based layout
Date Wed, 13 Nov 2002 15:59:22 GMT

Robert Koberg wrote:
> Howdy,
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: Nicola Ken Barozzi []
>>Robert Koberg wrote:
>>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>>From: Nicola Ken Barozzi []
>>>>Sent: Wednesday, November 13, 2002 5:56 AM
>>>>Robert Koberg wrote:
> <snip/>
>>>This is not my experience with skins. A skin only changes how it
>>looks - it does
>>>nothing to the underlying functionality.
>>Look at the skins for Windows Media Player or AIM for example, they can
>>reduce the overall functionality.
> They do that by exposing or hiding things, just like you can with CSS. They do
> not change how it works.


>>For example also for Forrest, we have skins that put the author on to,
>>on the botton, add or not the email, or even change the email from
>>name@domain to nameATdomain for anti spamming.
> These, to me, are configuration attributes for a folder that can be overrriden
> at the page level. Then based on the value the XSL decides what to do.

Ah, but you assume that they are all pre-decided. I want to be able to 
change them if needed in an easy way.

Mind me, I do agree that CSS+attributes is the way we should encourage 
our users to make skins, but I still want to have the XSL solution at hand.

>>But I concede that the general perception of skin is about giving
>>roughly the same stuff with a different appearance.
>>Although I fail to see how your CSS-only skin would make the pages
>>viewable on WAP, which I'm doing right now for some internal intranet pages.
> I only have slight experience with WAP. It seems to me that the skin for a WAP
> device is built in - you only send structure. I also think it is talking apples
> and oranges - for WAP you need a different set of bones. Just as you can't use
> (I think?) a winamp skin with AIM, you can't use an HTML browser skin for WAP.

Yup. I tend to call the "presentation" bones and the skin all "skin", 
and I agree we should instead go with a new terminology and encourage a 
more "layered" use of the current "skins".

> <snip/>
>>Then we can say it's a terminology issue.
>>That said, I still need the possibility of specifying a set of XSLs that
>>work on the output; one set would be the forrest system with the
>>corresponding skins, one would be the ken-wap system, etc.
>>What name do you propose?
> ?? bonesaw :) I guess I am just rambling so I will shut up now (don't all sigh
> at once :)


I think you are right, and probably skin is a bad name for that 
bone+skin hybrid we have now, but we need a name for those bones...

Nicola Ken Barozzi         
             - verba volant, scripta manent -
    (discussions get forgotten, just code remains)

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