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From Bert Van Kets <b...@vankets.com>
Subject RE: table tag in document v11
Date Tue, 23 Jul 2002 20:05:39 GMT
At 20:42 23/07/2002 +0400, you wrote:
> > From: Ross Gardler [mailto:ross@wkwyw.net]
> > Nicola Ken Barozzi wrote:
> > >
> > > Bert Van Kets wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > >> Here's a snip of the table template in document2html.xsl
> > >>   <xsl:template match="table">
> > >>     <table class="table" cellpadding="4" cellspacing="1">
> > >>       <xsl:apply-templates/>
> > >>     </table>
> > >> No background color, no cellpadding or cellspacing alternatives :(
> > >
> > >
> > > Which effectively don't belong there.
> > > They are not part of the content.
> >
> > I agree. I think that what we are really missing is the class
> > attribute:
> >
> >    <xsl:template match="table">
> >      <table class="@class">
> >        <xsl:apply-templates/>
> >      </table>
> >    </xsl:template>
> >
> > Then colour, padding etc goes in CSS where it belongs.
>
>+1. The 'class' attribute is needed on every [visual] element.
>Another option to control the presentation of a specific element is to use
>'id' attribute and define a #myclass CSS style using the 'id' as the name.
>
>This again raises the question 'how a user can specify custom CSS file to be
>used'.

Moving the presentation details entirely to CSS will make it rather 
difficult for larger projects to comply with every need. This is specially 
true for tables as they are used a lot for layout purposes.  Of course they 
were not intended for that purpose when they where implemented, but hey, 
what is the alternative apart from the complex CSS positioning?
Tables and TDs have a lot of attributes, which makes them ideal for layout 
fine tuning.  Moving this fine tuning to CSS will make it necessary to 
create a lot of classes. Beurk!  I'd rather have some default attribute 
values which can be overridden.

Adding a class attribute to every tag is a great idea and will give the 
users, who have some CSS knowledge, some control over the presentation 
layer.  If they don't know anything about CSS, they will have to do with 
what they got (same situation in every DTP prog).

I guess it boils down to one question : Does Forrest keep full control over 
the layout or do we give partial control to the document editors?  I guess 
giving full control to the editors is already out of the question.

All the above is assuming Forrest is used as a CMS with a (very) fixed layout.
I have been using Forrest to create a pure html site from xml and 
xslt.  SoC was enough reason to do this.  Apart from creating a new skin 
(not worth sharing because too specialized) I had to scale down 
document2html.xsl to make it possible to create the page specific layouts.

Bert



>Konstantin
>
>
> >
> > Ross
> >
> > >
> > >> If you want true control you have to get the validation
> > running and
> > >> remove the   <xsl:template match="node()|@*" priority="-1">.
> > >
> > >
> > > +1
> > >
> > >> Shoot me if I'm wrong.  Don't take too big a gun ;-)
> > >
> > >
> > > Naaa :-PPP
> > >
> >
> >
> >


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