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From Maximilian Michels <...@apache.org>
Subject Re: Redesigned "Features" page
Date Wed, 08 Jul 2015 10:10:29 GMT
+1 for updating it. It is a great improvement and we can still change
details subsequently.

On Wed, Jul 8, 2015 at 11:32 AM, Aljoscha Krettek <aljoscha@apache.org>
wrote:

> I would publish it, it is definitely better than the old one.
>
> On Wed, 8 Jul 2015 at 11:32 Stephan Ewen <sewen@apache.org> wrote:
>
> > So, what do we do with this now?
> >
> > On Tue, Jul 7, 2015 at 1:41 PM, Stephan Ewen <sewen@apache.org> wrote:
> >
> > > +1 to adding links
> > >
> > > In fact, all points should link to some documentation part.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Tue, Jul 7, 2015 at 1:33 PM, Gyula Fóra <gyula.fora@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > >
> > >> I think the content is pretty good, much better than before. But the
> > page
> > >> structure could be better (and this is very important in my opinion).
> > >> Now it just looks like a long list of features without any ways to
> > >> navigate
> > >> between them. We should probably have something at the top that
> > summarizes
> > >> the page.
> > >>
> > >> And maybe at the specific points we should add links to other pages
> (for
> > >> instance internals pages).
> > >>
> > >> Stephan Ewen <sewen@apache.org> ezt írta (időpont: 2015. júl.
7., K,
> > >> 13:22):
> > >>
> > >> > I actually put quite some thought into the structure of the points.
> > They
> > >> > reflect pretty much what I observed (meetups and talks) where people
> > get
> > >> > excited and what they are missing.
> > >> >
> > >> > The structure follows the line of through of "stream processor that
> > also
> > >> > does batch very well". And then separate the features as they
> > >> contribute to
> > >> > that.
> > >> >
> > >> > Intermixing features across their relation to streaming and batch
> has
> > >> not
> > >> > worked out for my presentations at all. It came across that Flink
> is a
> > >> > system with a multitude of aspects, but no one in the audience could
> > >> really
> > >> > say what Flink is good at in the end, where it stands out.
> > >> >
> > >> > The proposed structure makes this very clear:
> > >> >
> > >> >   - Flink is a kick-ass stream processor     (Strongest
> > differentiation
> > >> > from all other technology)
> > >> >   - Flink can also do batch very well          (It is broadly
> > applicable
> > >> > and strong)
> > >> >   - It surfaces nice APIs and rich libraries  (Low entry hurdle)
> > >> >   - It plays well with existing technology
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> > Stephan
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> > On Tue, Jul 7, 2015 at 12:22 PM, Fabian Hueske <fhueske@gmail.com>
> > >> wrote:
> > >> >
> > >> > > +1 for the clear and brief feature descriptions!
> > >> > >
> > >> > > I am not so sure about the structure of the points, especially
> > >> separating
> > >> > > "Streaming" and "Batch and Streaming in One System" does not
> support
> > >> the
> > >> > > message of a unified system, IMO.
> > >> > >
> > >> > > How about categorizing the points into three sections (Internals,
> > API,
> > >> > > Integration) and structuring the points for example as follows:
> > >> > >
> > >> > > -- High Performance, Robust Execution, and Fault-tolerance
> > >> > > High performance
> > >> > > Continuous Streaming Model with Flow Control
> > >> > > Fault-tolerance via Lightweight Distributed Snapshots
> > >> > > Memory Management
> > >> > > Iterations and Delta Iterations
> > >> > >
> > >> > > -- Ease of use, APIs, and Clear Semantics
> > >> > > One runtime for Streaming and Batch Processing
> > >> > > Expressive APIs (Batch + Streaming)
> > >> > > Exactly-once Semantics for Stateful Computations
> > >> > > Program Optimizer
> > >> > > Library Ecosystem
> > >> > >
> > >> > > -- Integration
> > >> > > Broad Integration
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Cheers, Fabian
> > >> > >
> > >> > > 2015-07-07 10:39 GMT+02:00 Till Rohrmann <trohrmann@apache.org>:
> > >> > >
> > >> > > > I also like the new feature page. I better conveys the strong
> > >> points of
> > >> > > > Flink, since it's more to the point.
> > >> > > >
> > >> > > > On Mon, Jul 6, 2015 at 6:09 PM, Stephan Ewen <sewen@apache.org>
> > >> wrote:
> > >> > > >
> > >> > > > > Thanks Max!
> > >> > > > >
> > >> > > > > Did not even know we had a github mirror of the flink-web
> > repo...
> > >> > > > >
> > >> > > > > On Mon, Jul 6, 2015 at 6:05 PM, Maximilian Michels
<
> > >> mxm@apache.org>
> > >> > > > wrote:
> > >> > > > >
> > >> > > > > > Hi Stephan,
> > >> > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > Thanks for the feature page update. I think it
is much more
> > >> > > informative
> > >> > > > > and
> > >> > > > > > better structured now.
> > >> > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > By the way, you could also open a pull request
for your
> > changes
> > >> on
> > >> > > > > > https://github.com/apache/flink-web/pulls
> > >> > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > Cheers,
> > >> > > > > > Max
> > >> > > > > >
> > >> > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > On Mon, Jul 6, 2015 at 3:28 PM, Fabian Hueske
<
> > >> fhueske@gmail.com>
> > >> > > > wrote:
> > >> > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > I'll be happy to help, eh draw ;-)
> > >> > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > 2015-07-06 15:22 GMT+02:00 Stephan Ewen <sewen@apache.org
> >:
> > >> > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > Hi all!
> > >> > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > I think that the "Features" page of
the website is a bit
> > >> out of
> > >> > > > date.
> > >> > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > I made an effort to stub a new one.
It is committed
> under
> > "
> > >> > > > > > > features_new.md
> > >> > > > > > > > "
> > >> > > > > > > > and not yet built as an HTML page.
> > >> > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > If you want to take a look and help
building this, pull
> > the
> > >> > > > flink-web
> > >> > > > > > git
> > >> > > > > > > > repository and build the website locally.
You can then
> > look
> > >> at
> > >> > it
> > >> > > > > > under "
> > >> > > > > > > > http://localhost:4000/index_new.html"
> > >> > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > So far, I am happy with the new contents.
Three things
> > >> remain
> > >> > to
> > >> > > be
> > >> > > > > > done:
> > >> > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > 1) The page misses a figure on Streaming
throughput and
> > >> > latency.
> > >> > > > > > > Currently,
> > >> > > > > > > > I am using a figure from some preliminary
measurements
> > made
> > >> by
> > >> > > > > Marton.
> > >> > > > > > > > IIRC, Robert is running some performance
tests right now
> > >> and we
> > >> > > can
> > >> > > > > use
> > >> > > > > > > his
> > >> > > > > > > > results to create a new figure.
> > >> > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > 2) The figures could use some love.
The concept is good,
> > but
> > >> > the
> > >> > > > > style
> > >> > > > > > > is a
> > >> > > > > > > > bit sterile. I was hoping that Fabian
would help out
> with
> > >> his
> > >> > > > amazing
> > >> > > > > > > style
> > >> > > > > > > > of drawing figures ;-)
> > >> > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > 3) More people should have a look and
say if we should
> > >> replace
> > >> > > the
> > >> > > > > > > current
> > >> > > > > > > > "Features" page with this new one
> > >> > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > > > Greetings,
> > >> > > > > > > > Stephan
> > >> > > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > > >
> > >> > > > > >
> > >> > > > >
> > >> > > >
> > >> > >
> > >> >
> > >>
> > >
> > >
> >
>

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