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From "Matthias J. Sax" <mj...@informatik.hu-berlin.de>
Subject Re: Flink on Wikipedia
Date Tue, 07 Jul 2015 15:22:29 GMT
Well. It is not "my" article. It is on Wikipedia. Anyone can (and
should) improve it!

On 07/07/2015 05:08 PM, Stephan Ewen wrote:
> It was just a suggestion.
> 
> @Matthias: You wrote the article, you decide. If you want to keep it,
> that's fine!
> 
> On Tue, Jul 7, 2015 at 4:57 PM, Matthias J. Sax <
> mjsax@informatik.hu-berlin.de> wrote:
> 
>> I agree with Kostas and don't see much danger that people get confused.
>> Nevertheless, I will update the history section accordingly.
>>
>>
>> On 07/07/2015 04:48 PM, Kostas Tzoumas wrote:
>>> I think it is clear to most people that the only official and (hopefully)
>>> up-to-date description of an Apache project is its Apache website, and
>> any
>>> paper can get outdated. Perhaps we can change the link to a more
>> up-to-date
>>> paper when we have one.
>>>
>>> I like the article, thanks Matthias!
>>>
>>> Kostas
>>>
>>> On Tue, Jul 7, 2015 at 4:43 PM, Stephan Ewen <sewen@apache.org> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Okay, I wrote a lot there
>>>>
>>>> tl:dr = Let's make sure people understand that the Stratosphere paper
>> does
>>>> not describe Flink.
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, Jul 7, 2015 at 4:33 PM, Matthias J. Sax <
>>>> mjsax@informatik.hu-berlin.de> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I can't follow. Stratosphere is only mentioned in the "History" part.
>> Of
>>>>> course, we can strike out "Stratosphere II" and make clear that Flink
>> is
>>>>> a fork on Stratosphere. But that is minor.
>>>>>
>>>>> And adding the Stratosphere papers as a reference, was the requirement
>>>>> to get the article accepted in the first place. Thus, it would not make
>>>>> sense to remove them. Currently, there are no other "reliable and
>>>>> notable" source (in term of Wikipedia guidelines) that can be used as
>>>>> references.
>>>>>
>>>>> Of course, the article is super short and needs to be extended. But the
>>>>> project is moving fast and only "stable" stuff should be on Wikipedia.
>>>>> It is hard enough to keep the project web page up to data. ;) Maybe,
we
>>>>> can discuss what should be included and what not.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> -Matthias
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On 07/07/2015 04:17 PM, Stephan Ewen wrote:
>>>>>> Thanks, Matthias, for starting this.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It looks a bit like the article talks more about the Stratosphere
>>>> project
>>>>>> than Flink right now.
>>>>>> I think we need to make a few things clear, to not confuse people:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 1) Flink != Stratosphere. When looking at the Stratosphere Paper
and
>>>> when
>>>>>> looking at Flink, you look at two completely different things. It
is
>>>> not
>>>>>> just that a name changed.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 2) It is not Stratosphere that became an Apache project. The project
>>>> that
>>>>>> became Apache Flink was forked from a subset of the Stratosphere
>>>> project
>>>>>> (core runtime only). That subset covered 1.5 out of the 5 areas of
>>>>>> Stratosphere.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> When Flink became an Apache project, the only features it contained
>>>> that
>>>>>> were developed as part of Stratosphere, were the iterations, and
the
>>>>>> optimizer. Everything else had been re-developed.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 3) Flink has nothing to do with Stratosphere II. Even though that
>>>>> research
>>>>>> project talks about streaming, they have a very different angle to
>>>> that.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I am writing this, because we are working heavy on making it easier
>> for
>>>>>> people to grasp what Flink is, and what it is not.
>>>>>> A system with so many features and so much different technology is
>>>> bound
>>>>> to
>>>>>> be hard to grasp.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The article gives people sources that seemingly describe what Flink
>> is,
>>>>> but
>>>>>> have little to do with what it is.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The relationship between Flink and Stratosphere is actually the
>>>>> following:
>>>>>> Flink is based on some research outcomes of Stratosphere (I), and
was
>>>>>> bootstrapped from a fork of the Stratosphere code base of late 2013.
>>>> Ever
>>>>>> since, these two have been proceeding independently.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I would suggest to change the article to clearly reflect that.
>>>> Otherwise,
>>>>>> we will not do Flink a favor, but confuse people.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Greetings,
>>>>>> Stephan
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Tue, Jul 7, 2015 at 10:40 AM, Henry Saputra <
>>>> henry.saputra@gmail.com>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Nice work indeed!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> - Henry
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Tue, Jul 7, 2015 at 1:25 AM, Chiwan Park <chiwanpark@apache.org>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Great! Nice start. :)
>>>>>>>> The logo is shown now.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>>> Chiwan Park
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Jul 7, 2015, at 5:06 PM, Maximilian Michels <mxm@apache.org>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Cool. Nice work, Matthias, and thanks for starting it
off.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Jul 6, 2015 at 11:45 PM, Matthias J. Sax <
>>>>>>>>> mjsax@informatik.hu-berlin.de> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Hi squirrels,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I am happy to announce Flink on Wikipedia:
>>>>>>>>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apache_Flink
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> The Logo Request is still pending, but should be
online soon.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> -Matthias
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
> 


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