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From Timothy Jones <Timothy.Jo...@syniverse.com>
Subject RE: future of flash (yes, that old chestnut again)
Date Wed, 15 May 2013 16:31:12 GMT
"Standards-based" is criteria #0 of the open internet.  No matter how slick, non-standards-based
technologies are not open, and __that_alone__ makes them inferior.  Open-sourcing Flex under
Apache was a great move, and that's why I monitor this mailing list.  I'm quite encouraged
by the events here since Adobe's donation of Flex to Apache 18 months ago.

But as long as Flex requires the proprietary Flash Player to run, the end-to-end result still
falls short of this most basic requirement.  Someday, Shumway or FalconJS will solve that!
 As a developer who prefers to work with Linux, the state of Flash Player on Linux has been
quite disappointing over the years.  By contrast, almost everything in the HTML5 world is
driven by the W3C, Firefox and Chrome, and because those communities value all users, new
features appear on Linux versions of those browsers at the same time as everywhere else. 
And this is the way it should be.  

It's odd to me how you question the profit-making motivations of the HTML5 community, when
they are the ones donating their time on W3C committees, building open source HTML5 libraries,
and giving it away, while not criticizing Adobe's profit-only decisions that do not strive
to treat all users equally well.  The "drive the web forward" initiative is quite real, and
among open-source developers, it is a far more powerful incentive than profit ever could be.
  You have *them* to thank for most of the things you enjoy on the internet today.  Without
forward-thinkers like them, we would still all be on CompuServe.

There, my $0.02ยข..
 (....now get off my lawn ... :-) )


-----Original Message-----
From: Mike_L_McConnell@lamd.uscourts.gov [mailto:Mike_L_McConnell@lamd.uscourts.gov] 
Sent: Wednesday, May 15, 2013 9:11 AM
To: users@flex.apache.org
Subject: Re: future of flash (yes, that old chestnut again)

I worry less about the message than I do the motivation behind the push towards HTML5.  It
still makes no sense to me from a developer's perspective, though I've tried very hard to
understand it.  "Standards based" or not, HTML5 is inferior technology when compared to what
can be delivered with Flash and AIR (and the ease with which it can be done using development
environments like Flex).  Users don't know or care about the runtime environment in which
their applications run, nor should they.  This isn't really about users, though.  It's not
about the web.  It's not about getting behind a "standard".  What it's about is creating demand
for products that make the difficult task of developing in HTML/CSS/JavaScript a bit more
palatable.  And where there's demand, there's profit (theoretically, anyway).  I don't believe
for a minute that this is some noble "drive the web forward" initiative.  That's only the
veneer.  The true goal, in my not so humble opinion, is what it always is and always will
be: enhancing the bottom line.  There's certainly nothing wrong with a company making money....it's
why they exist, after all.  But to tout what is clearly a less suitable solution (for RIAs)
as the next great frontier is, at best, disingenuous.  These are my opinions...your mileage
may vary.

M. McConnell

From:	Lee Burrows <subscriptions@leeburrows.com>
To:	users@flex.apache.org
Date:	05/15/2013 06:15 AM
Subject:	Re: future of flash (yes, that old chestnut again)

Thanks Alex.

I appreciate your comments - with the 5 year commitment from Adobe, and FlexJS on the horizon,
i can relax (a bit).

I just worry about your employers sometimes. At Max 2011, the message was "use HTML5 for RIAs",
and shortly afterwards mobile Flash Player was dropped. At Max 2013, the message was "use
HTML5 for games" - which made me wonder what bombshell Adobe may drop this time.

Lee Burrows

On 14/05/2013 20:29, Alex Harui wrote:
> The relevant documents are:
> [1] http://www.adobe.com/devnet/flashplatform/whitepapers/roadmap.html
> [2] http://www.adobe.com/devnet/flex/whitepapers/roadmap.html
> It is [2] that mentions "five years".
> But realize that, to the best of my knowledge, there is no code that 
> will cause Flash to stop working after some day about 4 years from 
> now.  To do
> would "break the web" and neither Adobe nor the major desktop/laptop 
> OS vendors are interested in doing that.  It is just that Adobe is not 
> committing to new versions or taking support calls after that date.
> IMO, if something happens that gives Adobe a reason to extend that 
> date, they probably would, but I don't really know what that would be.
> Meanwhile, Apache Flex is doing the best it can to make sure that Flex
> fewer bugs, supports more locales, etc.  And some of us are even 
> looking into a next generation of Flex that will let you use MXML and
> to create apps that run in a browser or on mobile devices without
> so you don't have be quite so concerned about this "five year"
> On 5/14/13 11:12 AM, "Lee Burrows" <subscriptions@leeburrows.com> wrote:
>> Hi All,
>> I seem to remember that Adobe committed to supporting Flash Player 
>> and AIR for 5 years - during, or shortly after, the Flex Community 
>> Summit (of Dec 11).
>> Is that right, or did i imagine it? - i cant find any reference to it 
>> on adobe.com

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