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From Richard Hirsch <hirsch.d...@gmail.com>
Subject Re: Turtles all the way down (or how I learned to love math in computing)
Date Tue, 11 Aug 2009 12:08:42 GMT
I like the idea of making ESME more available for other types of
applications. One application core with micro-blogging being one
example of an app that is based on the core.

But (and there is always a "but") - don't you you think you are moving
more towards ESME being a message-broker / service bus. If this is
intended, what then are the distinguishing characteristics regarding
other existing message brokers.

My other qustion would be: what remains of the existing application?
Could we save anything or must be start anew (groan) again.

D.

On Mon, Aug 10, 2009 at 11:09 PM, Anne Kathrine
Petterøe<yojibee@gmail.com> wrote:
> David,
>
> Sorry for the late and short reply. You have already said most of what I
> wanted to say by now :)
> I think we should definitely go for it.
>
> I am still wondering if we should still keep the "old" ESME too?
> Or will it be an either or situation?
>
> And regarding this:
> " I could conceivably refocus on G2 (but I do want to know more details) and
> let the UI masters work their magic."
> -- at the moment we don't have any UI masters on the team, which is turning
> into a *serious* problem.
> Anyone know a UI developer with free time on his hands?
>
> /Anne
>
>
> On 5. aug.. 2009, at 17.27, David Pollak wrote:
>
>> On Wed, Aug 5, 2009 at 7:57 AM, Vassil Dichev <vdichev@apache.org> wrote:
>>
>>>> Darren,
>>>> I fully agree with you.  I have no plans to make ESME harder to use.  At
>>>
>>> its
>>>>
>>>> core, it's a micro-messaging system.  On the other hand, I do want to
>>>
>>> make
>>>>
>>>> it easier for people who are not Scala developers with access to the
>>>> ESME
>>>> source code to build applications on top of ESME.  I view this class of
>>>
>>> user
>>>>
>>>> as similar to "Excel power users."  But Excel power users often
>>>
>>> distribute
>>>>
>>>> spreadsheets to their co-workers that allow the non-power-users to get
>>>> something new done.
>>>
>>> If it's too complicated, there could be a plugin/version "extra
>>> actions" the way there are separate formula packages for Excel.
>>
>>
>> Yeah... there has to be layered template libraries available to the power
>> users.  This is part of the business model that I'm thinking about...
>> basically... an eco-system (marketplace, app store) for composable
>> elements.
>>
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> For complex tasks like this, tooling matters. It should be easy to
>>> compose/debug.
>>
>>
>> Yes.  I've been thinking about "play this range of updates" or
>> "single-step
>> this range of updates" so you can see what would happen if you applied
>> certain transformations/accumulations.
>>
>>
>>> ESME has some similarities to Yahoo!Pipes- both reroute
>>> and transform pieces of text, but in a different context. However,
>>> Yahoo!Pipes makes it easy to assemble components graphically like Lego
>>> pieces, thereby ensuring that inappropriate pieces don't fit together.
>>
>>
>> Yep.  Yahoo! Pipes is a great visual builder... but it also feels very
>> "push" rather than "reach into the ether and find what I'm looking for."
>>
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Vassil
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Lift, the simply functional web framework http://liftweb.net
>> Beginning Scala http://www.apress.com/book/view/1430219890
>> Follow me: http://twitter.com/dpp
>> Git some: http://github.com/dpp
>
>

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