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From Stefan Seelmann <m...@stefan-seelmann.de>
Subject Re: Browser detection / status of version 2
Date Wed, 08 Jul 2015 20:27:45 GMT
Hi Werner,

many thanks for the detailed explanation.

I saw BrowserDataSource.xml and OperatingSystemDataSource.xml, but as I
found no "detection" patterns and as the also not loaded by the (Java)
devicemap-client I thought they are not used.

The project contains lot of pieces, I didn't yet figured out how they
fit together. Initially I just saw and tried the official released Java
device-map client. Now I digged a bit deeper and there are (at least) 4
Java clients in SVN

clients/1.0/java
clients/1.0/java_w3c_simple
clients/w3c-ddr
contrib/openddr/java

The one in "clients/w3c-ddr/simpleddr" actually is able to
detect/classify OS and browser including versions. It has lot of
specialized Builders which use regex matching to detect UAs (but e.g.
not Firefox on Windows). Support of an existing W3C API seems noble, but
with its data structructures and namespaces it is a bit cumbersome to use.

On the other hand the one in "clients/1.0/java" just seems to use the
patterns defined in BuilderDataSource.xml, without regex matching. It is
totally simple to use.

I think it makes sense to define patterns in data files, as different
client implementations can use the same data. Hardcoded parsers are more
difficult to port to other languages/platforms. Regex is quite powerful
but probably slower than simple character matching.

Sorry for dumping my findings and thoughts. I'm still try to find my way
into the project.

Kind Regards,
Stefan



On 07/08/2015 10:50 AM, Werner Keil wrote:
> Hello Stefan,
> 
> Thanks a lot for your input. You're asking some good and constructive
> questions.
> 
> With regards to what devices have a browser, this recent post on the
> DeviceAtlas (clearly the most visible and likely notable commercial vendor
> in this field) page
> https://deviceatlas.com/blog/which-devices-have-browsers
> It contains devices like XBox or even Samsung Gear, etc.
> 
> With regards to dealing with devices and browsers separately, the DDR
> standard and formats has always intended to do so, just look at
> https://svn.apache.org/viewvc/devicemap/trunk/data/1.0/device-data/src/main/resources/devicedata/BrowserDataSource.xml?view=co&revision=1686469&content-type=text%2Fplain
> but this and other XML files are clearly undervalued and barely used
> especially by the "Classifier" family of clients.
> 
> Other clients due to their W3C DDR compliant heritage do, but if the data
> is not maintained there, neither will get you proper results;-|
> 
> You're right, that some of the visions around 2.0 can be promising if
> there's enough support by the community. Neither of us can do this alone,
> and while some projects like this may be smaller than others, a key reason
> to donate the codebase of OpenDDR here was to increase the community where
> possible.
> 
> Aside from a service-based approach
> https://deviceatlas.com/resources/dynamic-data
> DeviceAtlas also makes it pretty clear, their primary format is JSON now:
> https://deviceatlas.com/resources/getting-the-data
> while it is safe to assume, other commercial closed-source alternatives
> like WURFL still dance around the WURFL.xml even if they may have stored it
> into some XML DB now, too;-)
> 
> An important effort is, to transform existing device information (our crown
> jewel after all;-) from XML to JSON once the new format or formats are
> defined and agreed on. Whether or not there's also a 2-way conversion, we
> shall see.
> You can be sure, commercial closed-source vendors like DeviceAtlas offer
> this but it's up to the community if we can and want to offer that as well.
> 
> Contributing e.g. via JIRA or (I think you may also self-register for that)
> the Wiki would be a good start. If you have concrete patches or code
> contributions, attaching them (as patch, diff or "snippet") to a JIRA
> ticket is a good practice to start helping. For some this lead to becoming
> a full committer, so we'd welcome others to do so if they help on a regular
> basis.
> 
> Thanks and Regards,
> 
> Werner
> 
> On Wed, Jul 8, 2015 at 12:24 AM, Stefan Seelmann <mail@stefan-seelmann.de>
> wrote:
> 
>> Hello,
>>
>> I have the need to classify not only mobile devices, but also desktop
>> browsers and other clients (e.g. email clients) including operating
>> system and versions. The current state of DeviceMap seems not suitable
>> for this, for example Firefox and Chrome are just classifed as
>> "desktopDevice".
>>
>> I already tried to add patterns to BuilderDataSourcePatch.xml and
>> DeviceDataSourcePatch.xml. That somehow worked, but if I understand the
>> data format correctlry I'd have to create one "device" per
>> OS+version/browser+version, which would result in an insane number of
>> combinations.
>>
>> Is there a better way to define data using the version 1 device data
>> format to achive my needs?
>>
>>
>> I also browsed the wiki and mailing list archive. The "Device Data 2.0"
>> specification looks very promising to me. There seem to be neither code
>> nor data (not even prototypes) available. Based on mailing list archive
>> I'm even not sure if there is consensus among the developers go for this
>> new data format.
>>
>> Are there plans within the community to develop the version 2?
>>
>> How can I help (with limited resources...)?
>>
>>
>> Kind Regards,
>> Stefan
>>
> 


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