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From Mark Struberg <strub...@yahoo.de>
Subject Re: cdi-query
Date Wed, 27 Jun 2012 18:07:58 GMT
Ok, I understand that point. Would it be fine to just have them in separated packages?

LieGrue,
strub


>________________________________
> From: Romain Manni-Bucau <rmannibucau@gmail.com>
>To: Mark Struberg <struberg@yahoo.de>; deltaspike-dev@incubator.apache.org 
>Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2012 7:53 PM
>Subject: Re: cdi-query
> 
>
>Not really, myfaces is not here.
>And you are as bas as me wanting to impose your view Mark.
>One jar by purpose is easier to maintain or patch too...one jar by class is a pain.
>On the ee/jee i think it is important to split to ease people to understand what they
use.
>- Romain
>Le 27 juin 2012 19:24, "Mark Struberg" <struberg@yahoo.de> a écrit :
>
>This is a perfectly bad example! With this shaded jar you cannot easily upgrade single
projects like MyFaces to a newer version...
>>
>>LieGrue,
>>strub
>>
>>
>>
>>----- Original Message -----
>>> From: Romain Manni-Bucau <rmannibucau@gmail.com>
>>> To: deltaspike-dev@incubator.apache.org
>>> Cc:
>>> Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2012 5:22 PM
>>> Subject: Re: cdi-query
>>>
>>> javaee-api in openejb for instance:
>>> http://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/openejb/trunk/javaee-api/pom.xml
>>>
>>> - Romain
>>>
>>>
>>> 2012/6/27 Pete Muir <pmuir@redhat.com>
>>>
>>>>  Do you have some good examples of shade working well, I've never ever
>>> seen
>>>>  it be a good approach for frameworks.
>>>>
>>>>  On 27 Jun 2012, at 11:17, Romain Manni-Bucau wrote:
>>>>
>>>>  > @Pete: DS can deliver fine grain modules which are nice for some part
>>> of
>>>>  > the users and shade modules ("big jar") for advances user.
>>> Just a maven
>>>>  > trick. this way everuone is happy and honestly today any nice IDE
>>>>  supports
>>>>  > it without any issue.
>>>>  >
>>>>  > - Romain
>>>>  >
>>>>  >
>>>>  > 2012/6/27 Pete Muir <pmuir@redhat.com>
>>>>  >
>>>>  >> It's insanely complex for a new user. Java is already
>>> confusing, with
>>>>  it's
>>>>  >> hundreds of libs. Adding more complexity to packaging won't
>>> help with
>>>>  >> DeltaSpike adoption IMO.
>>>>  >>
>>>>  >> On 27 Jun 2012, at 07:58, Romain Manni-Bucau wrote:
>>>>  >>
>>>>  >>> Mark,
>>>>  >>>
>>>>  >>> what's the issue? The thing to take care is to not create
>>> a module
>>>>  simply
>>>>  >>> for integration. But a module by feature is fine and nice
IMO.
>>>>  >>>
>>>>  >>> - Romain
>>>>  >>>
>>>>  >>>
>>>>  >>> 2012/6/27 Mark Struberg <struberg@yahoo.de>
>>>>  >>>
>>>>  >>>> Romain, Arne.
>>>>  >>>>
>>>>  >>>>
>>>>  >>>> Please make suggestions which classes/features we should
>>> push into
>>>>  which
>>>>  >>>> module. Any suggestion is welcome
>>>>  >>>> I think our whole JPA functionality is not that huge and
>>> are just 30
>>>>  >>>> classes overall. Splitting those into 6 modules (3x api
+
>>> impl each)
>>>>  >> might
>>>>  >>>> really be too much!
>>>>  >>>>
>>>>  >>>> LieGrue,
>>>>  >>>> strub
>>>>  >>>>
>>>>  >>>>
>>>>  >>>>
>>>>  >>>>
>>>>  >>>>> ________________________________
>>>>  >>>>> From: Arne Limburg
>>> <arne.limburg@openknowledge.de>
>>>>  >>>>> To: "deltaspike-dev@incubator.apache.org"
>>> <
>>>>  >>>> deltaspike-dev@incubator.apache.org>
>>>>  >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2012 1:07 PM
>>>>  >>>>> Subject: AW: cdi-query
>>>>  >>>>>
>>>>  >>>>> I completely agree with Romain on that topic
>>>>  >>>>>
>>>>  >>>>> -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
>>>>  >>>>> Von: Romain Manni-Bucau [mailto:rmannibucau@gmail.com]
>>>>  >>>>> Gesendet: Mittwoch, 27. Juni 2012 11:46
>>>>  >>>>> An: deltaspike-dev@incubator.apache.org
>>>>  >>>>> Betreff: Re: cdi-query
>>>>  >>>>>
>>>>  >>>>> Still not totally agree on modules stuff (should it
be
>>> pushed in
>>>>  >> another
>>>>  >>>> thread?), in particular from a user perspective. I think
>>> allowing
>>>>  users
>>>>  >> to
>>>>  >>>> take small bundle or an already aggregated one (shade)
is
>>> a great
>>>>  >> feature.
>>>>  >>>>>
>>>>  >>>>> - Romain
>>>>  >>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>
>>>>  >>>>> 2012/6/27 Thomas Hug
>>> <Thomas.Hug@ctp-consulting.com>
>>>>  >>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>> @Mark, +1 on not being excessive on the amount
of
>>> modules. As a
>>>>  user I
>>>>  >>>>>> don't think I'd like maintaining another x
>>> dependencies, those POMs
>>>>  >>>>>> are usually big enough :-) Anyway, depending on
>>> the amount of
>>>>  features
>>>>  >>>>>> integrating for such a query API, that might well
>>> fall into the
>>>>  >>>>>> "decent size" category.
>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>> @Pete, +1 for the ServiceHandler - IMO very
>>> convenient when using
>>>>  >>>>>> methods just as metadata (e.g. for calling stored
>>> procs, obviously
>>>>  JPA
>>>>  >>>>>> queries or a JAX-RS client).
>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>> @Jason, Bernard: Agree that I have rarely used
the
>>> Home API in a
>>>>  >>>>>> productive application, still I found it quite
>>> handy for
>>>>  prototyping.
>>>>  >>>>>> Could be useful to add this on top of a query
API
>>> (and create e.g. a
>>>>  >>>>>> Forge scaffolding provider?).
>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>  >>>>>> Tom
>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>  >>>>>> From: Mark Struberg [mailto:struberg@yahoo.de]
>>>>  >>>>>> Sent: Dienstag, 26. Juni 2012 07:58
>>>>  >>>>>> To: deltaspike-dev@incubator.apache.org
>>>>  >>>>>> Subject: Re: cdi-query
>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>> I fear that would get us into jarmageddon...
>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>> We discussed the module structure at the very
>>> beginning, and we all
>>>>  >>>>>> concluded that there are 2 reasons for introducing
>>> a new module:
>>>>  >>>>>> .) a dependency to another project or EE api (like
>>> jta, jpa, jsf)
>>>>  >>>>>> .) an area which is an completely own block and
>>> has a decent size
>>>>  (min
>>>>  >>>>>> ~30..50 new classes)
>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>> Since the whole JPA area doesn't have more
>>> than 10 classes yet, I do
>>>>  >>>>>> not see a reason for introducing a new API for
>>> them.
>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>> Also the whole EE vs SE is moot imo. Either we
>>> have a new API or
>>>>  not.
>>>>  >>>>>> The classic J2EE patterns are dead dead dead
>>> anyway. EE-6 gave us
>>>>  much
>>>>  >>>>>> better possibilities, so we should use them and
>>> not fall back to
>>>>  _old_
>>>>  >>>> EE patterns.
>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>> What we could do is to disucss whether the
>>> 'jta' module would better
>>>>  >>>>>> called 'deltaspike-jpa-ee' and not only
>>> contain JTA but also
>>>>  >>>>>> TransactionAttributeType handling from EJB?
>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>> LieGrue,
>>>>  >>>>>> strub
>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>  >>>>>>> From: Romain Manni-Bucau
>>> <rmannibucau@gmail.com>
>>>>  >>>>>>> To: deltaspike-dev@incubator.apache.org
>>>>  >>>>>>> Cc:
>>>>  >>>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 12:30 AM
>>>>  >>>>>>> Subject: Re: cdi-query
>>>>  >>>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>> +1
>>>>  >>>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>> - Romain
>>>>  >>>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>> 2012/6/26 Gerhard Petracek
>>> <gerhard.petracek@gmail.com>
>>>>  >>>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>>> @ pete:
>>>>  >>>>>>>> +1
>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>>> @ java-se vs java-ee features:
>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>>> we can think about a more fine-grained
>>> structure (similar to
>>>>  seam3).
>>>>  >>>>>>>> e.g.:
>>>>  >>>>>>>> deltaspike-jpa-transaction
>>>>  >>>>>>>> deltaspike-jpa-query
>>>>  >>>>>>>> ...
>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>>> regards,
>>>>  >>>>>>>> gerhard
>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>>> 2012/6/25 Pete Muir
>>> <pmuir@redhat.com>
>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>>>> Well, we were looking for some good
>>> use cases for the
>>>>  >>>> ServiceHandler.
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>>>> I would be in support of adding it
to
>>> DS core, now we have a
>>>>  >>>>>>>> strong
>>>>  >>>>>>> use
>>>>  >>>>>>>>> case.
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>>>> Property util should not be
>>> controversial. Maybe we can improve
>>>>  >>>>>>> it's API
>>>>  >>>>>>>>> whilst we are at it :-)
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>>>> On 25 Jun 2012, at 10:25, Thomas Hug
>>> wrote:
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>> Eventually this came in a little
>>> early, but it's already on
>>>>  >>>>>>> the radar:
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>> https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/DELTASPIKE-60
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>> The current implementation mainly
>>> depends on the Solder
>>>>  >>>>>>> ServiceHandler
>>>>  >>>>>>>>> (as far as I remember not yet in DS,
>>> waiting for CDI 1.1) and
>>>>  >>>>>>>> the Property  > utils.
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>> Tom
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>> ________________________________________
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>> Von: Mark Struberg
>>> [struberg@yahoo.de]  > > Gesendet: Montag,
>>>>  >>>>>>>> 25. Juni 2012 14:21  > > An:
>>> deltaspike-dev@incubator.apache.org
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>> Betreff: Re: cdi-query
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>> +1 great stuff to review and add
>>> them!
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>> That would fit great into the
>>> deltaspike-jpa module, wdyt?
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>> LieGrue,
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>> strub
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>> From: Pete Muir
>>> <pmuir@redhat.com>  > >> To:
>>>>  >>>>>>>> deltaspike-dev@incubator.apache.org
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>> Cc:
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Monday, June 25, 2012
>>> 1:53 PM  > >> Subject: Re:
>>>>  >>>>>>>> cdi-query  > >>  > >>
>>> IMO this would be a great thing to add!
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>> On 24 Jun 2012, at 16:56,
>>> Romain Manni-Bucau wrote:
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>>> Hi,
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>>> just browsed
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>> http://ctpconsulting.github.com/query/1.0.0.Alpha4/index.html
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>> and
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>>> it is really amazing (a
>>> spring-data CDI oriented).
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>>> it is currently based
on
>>> solder but since DS integrates a
>>>>  >>>>>>> lot of this
>>>>  >>>>>>>>> stuff
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>>> i wonder if it could be
>>> integrated in DS in a really
>>>>  >>>>>>> portable way?
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>>> - Romain
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>
>>>>  >>>>>
>>>>  >>>>
>>>>  >>
>>>>  >>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
>

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